Relationships and Romance

Chrono7

Completely Average High School Student
Sounds tough. One thing you could try would be don't reply for a while. Not in the treat em' mean sense, but just to give her time and you both a bit of perspective. If she was the last one to get back to you, just leave it for a bit. You can get back to her in due course and you can focus on you, whilst you decide when is best to reply. Like you said, it can sometimes be unfair to put an emotional burden on another, so it may give her a bit of breathing space and allow her in time to open up on any feelings she may have. If you're always the one to immediately reply to her, then she has the advantage. I'm not saying that she's doing it on purpose, but she may not realise that it is demanding on you. Just play it cool! Good luck!
 

burtkenobi

Brigade Leader
I'll just say it again, I think it's a mistake to presume to know the workings of anybody else's mind or circumstances, especially anyone you don't actually know personally. If the situation was clear to anyone it would be Vash, who actually knows her, not me or you.

I do agree, actually, with @ayase - we can't know the workings of anybody's mind.

My post was about whether there was any awareness of the affect on Vash, and that understanding people's minds are different works both ways - she might be doing whatever it is for her own reasons, but she can at least imagine or empathise with what that behaviour is doing to him. I don't think it's very fair.
 

IncendiaryLemon

Captain Karen
AUKN Staff
Does anyone know how Lemon's doing? Haven't seen him on here for a while.
No idea, unfortunately. ☹
Does he use the Discord now? I've never been on that.

Hi guys, sorry if I caused any worry. It wasn't exactly my intent to disappear for the better part of a year, but a lot of things have happened since the last time I really checked in here. Since around October last year, something happened that caused my mental health to spiral into an incredibly bad place. It's quite personal so I won't go into it, but the effects of what happened are something I still feel today, albeit I'm in a bit of a better state now than I was in the immediate fallout. I ended up closing myself off from both close friends and family, only leaving the house for work, spending almost whole days in bed and practically starving myself. Needless to say, it was bad times. I've since started taking anti-depressents, which do help, even if they haven't completely fixed my mental state.

Since I was last here, I also moved out of my parents house and in with a friend, which has also been a big adjustment for me. I don't have space for a desktop PC anymore because my house ended up being a lot smaller than my parents place, so I am generally spending a lot less time online just in general. This is also not to mention the whole corona virus thing, which saw me starting work at 2am for a time, which I found to be incredibly draining.

The last 4 months or so I've also tried to get back into the dating scene, to no avail. I've had a couple of promising starts but both ended up fizzling out into nothing. This compounded with the person I share a house with starting a long term relationship around the time we moved in together has had a bit of a negative effect on my mental health too. Either she comes to our house, in which case I have to bear witness to their ideal relationship, or he's away at her house, making me feel incredibly alone.

I'm sorry to go on a lot, but I thought that you should know where I'm at since you were kind enough to miss me. I'm sorry if I'm not the same kind of person I was when I left, a lot has happened, and even though I've been struggling with depression for a long time, the end of last year was the straw that broke the camel's back, and I'm at a point where I'm unsure I can ever be back to feeling how I was.

I won't be around as much as I was, but I will try to pop in as and when I can. If anyone ever wants to reach out, DM me on here or Discord, just not my Twitter, I had to come off that for reasons linked to what I spoke about above.

I hope everyone is doing well, it'd be nice to catch up with some of you.
 

Rui

Karamatsu Boy
Administrator
I'm sorry to go on a lot, but I thought that you should know where I'm at since you were kind enough to miss me. I'm sorry if I'm not the same kind of person I was when I left, a lot has happened, and even though I've been struggling with depression for a long time, the end of last year was the straw that broke the camel's back, and I'm at a point where I'm unsure I can ever be back to feeling how I was.

Welcome back, Lemon. I won't pretend to know what you have been going through but on this point, I just want to say that there's no need to fear the future you not being the same person. We are all the products of our past selves and our environment, and even when we seem to have our stuff together we're still adapting, growing and changing on a daily basis. The old you is still there, and the new you is going to be even better. It's really cool of you to speak frankly about everything you're feeling and I hope you'll keep doing that, to the extent that you're comfortable, whenever you need to unload. Reach out as much as you need to, to the people you trust. Even if it feels tough through the self-doubt of depression, being open encourages other people to share too. It's a powerful thing to do, and I know already that the person who wrote that post is on the right track.

R
 

IncendiaryLemon

Captain Karen
AUKN Staff
Welcome back, Lemon. I won't pretend to know what you have been going through but on this point, I just want to say that there's no need to fear the future you not being the same person. We are all the products of our past selves and our environment, and even when we seem to have our stuff together we're still adapting, growing and changing on a daily basis. The old you is still there, and the new you is going to be even better. It's really cool of you to speak frankly about everything you're feeling and I hope you'll keep doing that, to the extent that you're comfortable, whenever you need to unload. Reach out as much as you need to, to the people you trust. Even if it feels tough through the self-doubt of depression, being open encourages other people to share too. It's a powerful thing to do, and I know already that the person who wrote that post is on the right track.

R

Thank you Rui, your words really do mean a lot. I can only hope I can become a better and happier person than ever before.
 

IncendiaryLemon

Captain Karen
AUKN Staff
In my last post here, I mentioned how I didn't want to go into the details of what caused my leave of absence from the internet and ultimately what caused my mental health to spiral, but recently, my depression has been worsening a lot, and I've been feeling worse now than I have in months this past week, and without anyone to talk to or anywhere else to turn, I was hoping I could use a post here to vent my feelings a little and to get some things off my chest. This is probably going to be a lengthy ramble, and I can't even promise it'll make sense to anyone reading it but me, but I just really need a release here. My head feels like it's suffocating and I just can't shed the sadness and intrusive thoughts going through my mind. I'm hoping that this helps a little.

This all started about a year and a half ago now, in January of 2019. Someone who had followed me on Twitter a while ago messaged me out of the blue to wish me a happy new year. I was a little caught off guard, I hadn't really talked to her all that much during the short time we had followed each other for, but never one to shy away from making a new friend, we started chatting. What started as just general chit chat soon blossomed into lengthy and fairly deep conversations, and we would talk to each other over DM every single day. It was probably a little quick, but after a few weeks, I began to fall in love with her. I'm a very socially awkward person, and I feel I'm really awful at talking to people, but with her, it was so different. We never struggled to find something to talk about, and we got along so well, it was chemistry like I've honestly never felt before. She was just so much fun to talk to, so quirky and interesting, yet so kind and sweet. Add in a mutual interest of anime, manga and video games, and she was just the absolute perfect match for me, not to mention she was absolutely beautiful.

Even before everything that happened in 2019 happened, I'm not going to pretend that I was a totally mentally healthy person. My total social awkwardness has left me single for my entire life up to this point, so I pined for love incredibly hard, which tends to make me a little on the obsessive side. When I start to get feelings towards someone, that person suddenly becomes my whole world, as if nothing else matters to me. I appreciate that is not at all a mentally sound or healthy mindset to have, yet it's something I have unwittingly managed to adopt at some point in my life, and it was this that started to drive her away. She was an incredibly busy person, yet if she went a little while without talking to me, I'd message her and make sure she was okay, and I hadn't upset her, putting pressure on her to give me attention even if she didn't have time or wasn't in the mood to talk. I'd send her incredibly lengthy, sometimes essay length messages, even though she told me to stop because she found the prospect of replying to my messages to be overwhelming and time consuming. Despite her very politely telling me these things, I struggled to stop and change. Even after telling her I would stop, I'd always slide back into old habits and revert back to my old ways. I'm not sure if it was because of this or in spite of it that when I ended up confessing my feelings towards her, she turned me down.

It's at this point when I should have just taken no for an answer, continued being friends with her, and just continued with my life, but for some reason, I just could not let her go. Even after a polite "no", I would continue my romantic affection towards her. This would end up causing many an upset and argument between us. I felt so bad every time we fought, it felt like each time was the end of everything between us, I even made her cry and several occasions, purely because she did love me as a friend, and did value me, but wanted me to stop trying to force her into being something that I wanted her to be. Despite this though, I just never did stop loving her, despite all of the times I promised to move on.

It was then in October that came the breaking point. It was inevitable, I knew it was coming, but I was never quite prepared. She got a boyfriend. It broke me. Perhaps it might have been more wise to just keep my feelings to myself but I told her how it made me feel, I told her that I was crushed, that I felt as if my world was ending, that I loved her more than anything in the world and my heart was in two. In hindsight, this was incredibly selfish. A close friend had found happiness in the form of love and all I could do was tell her how much it hurt me. This whole incident drove a huge wedge between us that, despite trying, changed things between us completely. We stopped speaking for a while, and even when we did reconnect a little later on, it just wasn't the same as it was. Determined to move past this, I jumped on Tinder, and I actually did end up talking to someone for a few weeks, and it looked like it might actually be going somewhere. In my heart, I knew I still was in love with someone else, and the spark was nowhere near what I felt with her, but I thought if I don't at least try to love someone else, I'll never get anywhere.

To prove that I was trying to move on, I decide to tell her that I had met someone on Tinder and we were getting along well, and we might start dating soon, and she was so thrilled for me. If anything, it kind of reignited that lost friendship a little bit, with her knowing I was finally moving past her and onto someone else. We were okay for a few weeks, but then she tells me that she's having issues with her relationship, and would potentially break up with her boyfriend. In my infinite wisdom, I decided to tell her that I was still in love with her, and how much I wanted to be with her, even despite the girl I met from Tinder in the equation. She was outraged, and rightly so. She called me selfish, said I was just using this girl from Tinder as a means to get over or replace her, even though I didn't have any real feelings towards her, and she was right. After that, she said she was going to block me on the messaging app we use, and that she wanted space from me, and she would talk to me again when she thought it appropriate. This was in May, it's now almost August, and I haven't had any contact with her since.

We'd gone a few weeks without talking before, perhaps a little over a month, but it has never been this long. I am beginning to lose hope that she will ever want to talk to me again. I got into a drunken mess last week, and made the mistake of trying to DM her over Twitter, begging her to just speak to me, and that I just wanted to be friends, and how I regretted everything. I got no response, even in the morning when I messaged her an apology for my drunk texts. When I was drunk, I also had a glance at her Twitter page, something I hadn't done since October, and she seems to be in a relationship still, although if that's with someone new or the same guy as before, I'm unsure.

It's this silence that I find so deafening and what's depressing me so much. This time, I think we're done for real. I think she has finally decided that she is better off without me in her life, and that hurts. It hurts so much. I'm not undeserving of it, she has given me chance after chance after chance, and I ruined things every single time through my inability to learn and grow as a person. I was too busy chasing a relationship that was never happening that I ended up sacrificing a very real and very close friendship that I should have treasured more than anything, and that I would trade the world for to get back.

I'm not bitter about anything, I'm glad that she's happy and has someone, after getting to know her, I can honestly say she deserves to be happy more than anyone I know, I just wish it didn't have to come at the expense of my own happiness. I still feel like I'm in love with her, even now, as silly as it is. I just cannot move forward. Even though I fully accept and appreciate it will never, ever happen, I have just never felt anything like I've felt for her, and I'm not sure I ever will, and that scares me. She really is unique, one of a kind, and I don't think I will ever find anyone else quite like her. Even if I did, I'm ever more scared that I'll mistreat them and push them away just like I did before. I don't think I can handle this sort of pain again. It's been 10 months since my heart got broken, and I'm still here picking up the pieces, dealing with the depression every day. constantly feeling as if I'm going to break down crying. I'm just fully incapable of moving past this, and I don't know for how much longer I can take this sort of emotional pain. The anti depressants helped for a time, but this last week has seemingly rendered them ineffective once more.

I appreciate I have a lot of friends here, but if after reading this you determine I'm not a good or nice person anymore, then I don't blame you. I have done some really bad and upsetting things to a girl I love more than anyone or anything in the world, and as much as I regret what happened, I can't take any of it back. I am a bad person, a bad friend. I try not to be as self depreciating as I once was, but this much seems obvious. The more I think about it, the more I think that I probably didn't deserve to be with her to begin with. I realise this has gone on forever and I don't expect anyone at all to read this, but I just really needed to get these feelings down somewhere. Maybe I'll regret making any of this public, I'm not sure, but I just really needed to vent. I hope you all understand. I'm sorry if I've let anyone down.
 

Rui

Karamatsu Boy
Administrator
I don't think you're a bad person at all, Lemon. Clumsy, sure, but anyone who says they have never messed up a meaningful relationship before has probably never had one. I'm quite a bit older than you, I think, but I still argue with some of my close friends now and then. Sometimes it's my fault, sometimes it's theirs, and so long as it doesn't break us it's all just part of the process of learning about one another as human beings. Your clumsiness hasn't hurt her as much as you've hurt yourself and I think it would be healthy to admit that and stop beating yourself up about ruining things. You can't imagine it right now but you will feel love again and it will be different to what you felt for her, and that's ok. Maybe you will always love her too, and that's ok too. I love my closest friends very deeply, on a level that is definitely not portrayed in the media as normal, and I oscillate wildly between being too intense and too aloof. We all have to figure out what works for us and our friends individually.

I once had a relationship which 'went bad' like you describe (it was a friendship with zero romance on either side, but it was still a close friendship and very important to both of us). And you do need to give her the time she needs. She has already told you that she will end the silence when she's ready so it's not like you have anything left to learn, and as you have already realised, continuing to nag her will only convince her more that she's not ready for the emotional investment of being responsible for your happiness. She was happy for you when you found someone else. She wants to be your friend, but she also wants you to spread yourself further so that your time together is special. It's only been three months. I know this isn't what you want to hear, but when my friend and I stopped speaking it took ten years before I was ready to forgive him. It probably won't take that long for you guys; I'm unusually stubborn and my friend was ready to bury the hatchet many years before I was. It was hard. I missed him bitterly every day that we weren't speaking. But I needed that time, and to be the one to initiate things again rather than compromising on the other person's schedule. We are good friends again now and chat several times a week. You can't shortcut it by saying you've changed; that risks building up expectations which will make each successive setback even worse. It didn't work last time and it won't work this time either; there are no magic words that you can say in your DMs, drunk or otherwise, that will fix something that mostly needs time to heal.

But the waiting is driving you crazy, and that's understandable. You need to fill the time with other stuff - not a new romance, though if that happens anyway that's great. Otherwise, you need to find something that makes you happy in some small way so that you can remember what it feels like to care about things other than your perceived failings. Maybe caring for a pet will give you that outlet, or meeting new people in a different circle, or writing a self-indulgent blog that forces you into a routine of analysing your thoughts and getting some content down even when you're not in the mood to do anything at all. I don't know what works for you. I have a really bossy rescue cat who is always happy to absorb my loneliness when I'm feeling down about something so that's my outlet. He doesn't care about my job or my social life at all, so we have a very pure relationship with no expectations.

My partner once told me something very important at the start of our relationship. I casually asked whether they felt they needed me, because in that moment I thought it was romantic and powerful and wonderful. I wanted to be needed. The response was sort of blunt. "No. I don't need you at all. I'm only with you because I want to be with you." Our relationship has stayed on that basis ever since, and even though it was sort of crushing to be bluntly told I wasn't needed (lol), it turns out that it was what I needed to hear. Relationships are weird, and the way that they're portrayed in the media is weirder still. You've learnt a lot and grown immeasurably as a person since January 2019. You'll keep growing. There's a ton of wisdom in your post even if the negative points are still too sore for that wisdom to shine through.

R
 

IncendiaryLemon

Captain Karen
AUKN Staff
I don't think you're a bad person at all, Lemon. Clumsy, sure, but anyone who says they have never messed up a meaningful relationship before has probably never had one. I'm quite a bit older than you, I think, but I still argue with some of my close friends now and then. Sometimes it's my fault, sometimes it's theirs, and so long as it doesn't break us it's all just part of the process of learning about one another as human beings. Your clumsiness hasn't hurt her as much as you've hurt yourself and I think it would be healthy to admit that and stop beating yourself up about ruining things. You can't imagine it right now but you will feel love again and it will be different to what you felt for her, and that's ok. Maybe you will always love her too, and that's ok too. I love my closest friends very deeply, on a level that is definitely not portrayed in the media as normal, and I oscillate wildly between being too intense and too aloof. We all have to figure out what works for us and our friends individually.

I once had a relationship which 'went bad' like you describe (it was a friendship with zero romance on either side, but it was still a close friendship and very important to both of us). And you do need to give her the time she needs. She has already told you that she will end the silence when she's ready so it's not like you have anything left to learn, and as you have already realised, continuing to nag her will only convince her more that she's not ready for the emotional investment of being responsible for your happiness. She was happy for you when you found someone else. She wants to be your friend, but she also wants you to spread yourself further so that your time together is special. It's only been three months. I know this isn't what you want to hear, but when my friend and I stopped speaking it took ten years before I was ready to forgive him. It probably won't take that long for you guys; I'm unusually stubborn and my friend was ready to bury the hatchet many years before I was. It was hard. I missed him bitterly every day that we weren't speaking. But I needed that time, and to be the one to initiate things again rather than compromising on the other person's schedule. We are good friends again now and chat several times a week. You can't shortcut it by saying you've changed; that risks building up expectations which will make each successive setback even worse. It didn't work last time and it won't work this time either; there are no magic words that you can say in your DMs, drunk or otherwise, that will fix something that mostly needs time to heal.

But the waiting is driving you crazy, and that's understandable. You need to fill the time with other stuff - not a new romance, though if that happens anyway that's great. Otherwise, you need to find something that makes you happy in some small way so that you can remember what it feels like to care about things other than your perceived failings. Maybe caring for a pet will give you that outlet, or meeting new people in a different circle, or writing a self-indulgent blog that forces you into a routine of analysing your thoughts and getting some content down even when you're not in the mood to do anything at all. I don't know what works for you. I have a really bossy rescue cat who is always happy to absorb my loneliness when I'm feeling down about something so that's my outlet. He doesn't care about my job or my social life at all, so we have a very pure relationship with no expectations.

My partner once told me something very important at the start of our relationship. I casually asked whether they felt they needed me, because in that moment I thought it was romantic and powerful and wonderful. I wanted to be needed. The response was sort of blunt. "No. I don't need you at all. I'm only with you because I want to be with you." Our relationship has stayed on that basis ever since, and even though it was sort of crushing to be bluntly told I wasn't needed (lol), it turns out that it was what I needed to hear. Relationships are weird, and the way that they're portrayed in the media is weirder still. You've learnt a lot and grown immeasurably as a person since January 2019. You'll keep growing. There's a ton of wisdom in your post even if the negative points are still too sore for that wisdom to shine through.

R

Thanks for the reply Rui. I appreciate that you (and a few others) actually took the time to read my massively post. I think you're right in that I need to forgive myself a little before I can fully move forward, I'm just finding it difficult. I actually thought for the longest time that she was going to be the one for me, and this was it, and I often just sit and think how things might have turned out differently if I'd not acted the way I did sometimes. Of course, no one can ever know how things might have turned out, all we have is the present, and that's what I have to deal with.

I'm glad you and your friend managed to work things out in the end. Even if it does take 10 years, I'd be willing to wait. Pretending I had changed and moved on did more harm than good, as you said, and it's probably for the best to take the time and wait until those feelings have legitimately cooled down or disappeared completely. I'm not sure that I'm capable of 'just being friends' at this moment in time, no matter how much I wish I could make myself content with that. I think filling that void will also be an important step of healing, but I've still yet to figure that part out yet, hopefully it will come in time.

I think that is part of my problem. I also want to be needed, but no one has ever needed me. I have so much love to give someone in return, but no one has ever wanted it. It really hurts to not be good enough for anyone. I'm not sure how to get past that. Things are still incredibly sore right now, but I hope that you're right, and this experience has at least changed me for the better if nothing else. Time heals all wounds, as they say, and I'm sure even if it takes years, I'll get there at some point.
 

IncendiaryLemon

Captain Karen
AUKN Staff
I'm not sure if people here might tire of how frequently I post here, and about the same thing over and over no less, so before I continue, just know this is more just for me than for anyone else. It's good to get things off your chest and into the open sometimes. I don't expect people to read my posts in this thread, but if you do, thank you for caring, I appreciate you.

So, a few weeks back, I went on a date. I finally managed to actually convince someone on Tinder I was both not a complete bore or a serial killer, so we met up for a few drinks. I've been kind of conflicted on my feelings on it ever since. It didn't go badly, there was plenty of conversation, no awkward silences really, we both had a decently good time. Yet, afterwards, I couldn't help but feel sad. The sadness came from a weird place that took me a while to understand myself, but I think it was that I just didn't care. If she walked away from that date and then never spoke to me again, blocked my number and vanished from my life, I wouldn't feel a thing. There was just nothing there. She was a lovely girl, nothing I can really say I didn't like about her, but yet, I just felt nothing but apathy. Maybe that was expecting a bit much from a first date, after only messaging for a few weeks but my mind kept calling back, as it often does, to the other girl, the one who I fell hard for but who rejected me. That spark was just instantly there. Perhaps it was too quick on my behalf, I must admit, but I loved her within a few weeks, and despite never even meeting her in person, I still loved her more than I have anyone in my whole life.

A big part of me thought that as soon as I could get another girl into my life, I could get over her, and that would be that, clean break. Yet here I am, with a golden opportunity with a nice girl, and it just doesn't feel right. I still question if it's even moral of me to even peruse relationships at this point, when I am still so clearly hung up on this girl who I haven't spoken to in nigh on 6 months now. I try and I try but I still can't help but think about her every day. I miss her, I really do, and I would give anything in the world just to be able to talk to her again. Not that I haven't enough chances already, and I realise to want that is selfish, but it's true. I'm not even sure if it's right though. My mental health has been improving since she stopped talking to me, honestly, and I don't think that's a coincidence. As much as I do love her, not getting that feeling back whilst still trying to maintain a friendship was killing me. If she came back into my life, would I slip back into my total emotional dependence on her again? Would just being friends still not be good enough, and I end up hurting her again, or hurting myself again? I just don't know. I don't even know if I want love anymore. I thought a girlfriend was the be all and end all, and yet now I'm not so sure. I just want to feel how I did last year again, a feeling of true happiness. It was fleeting, but last year was the first and only time in my life where I can say I was truely happy, and it was because of her. I just want to get back to that place again emotionally, and I don't think through her is the right way to go about that, but she is the only person to ever make me feel that way. I just feel lost and confused at this point. I don't even know what I want anymore. I want to move past this, but I still feel I can't. I'm so weak. I have a friend at work who managed to move on from his wife whom he had two kids with quicker than I have managed to move on from a girl who I have never had physical contact with. It's a little sad really. I hope I don't come across as obsessive, I just feel she left a lasting impression on my life, more than almost anyone else. I told her a few times that she really lit up my life. Now I kind of feel like I've been left in the dark. I just don't know what to do anymore.
 
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IncendiaryLemon, I'm still a bit hung up on someone who was never in love with me back so I really relate to some of what you said. He and I were friends for a few years after meeting on a dating website and I could not stop thinking about him, a lot of stuff happened while we were friends and the sexual tension was off the charts, one week when he came to visit we ended up making out loads and it was so much better than most of the actual sex I had had up to that point... I've honestly never met anyone else who could make me feel that much from just kissing. I am autistic and I think I'm a bit sex repulsed at least when it comes to certain things like mouths (the wetness is too much for me most of the time) and other bodily fluids but I just really connected with him and nothing about him grossed me out at all, and I couldn't stop noticing how handsome he was it was like looking into the face of an angel. He obviously cared about me a lot and there were all these little things that made up our friendship that were cute and funny and we had this amazing rapport and even when we didn't kiss we cuddled a lot... but eventually he met someone who he did fall for and now she won't let him talk to me :( I mean I understand that moving on was necessary at some point but I miss my friend :( I'm really sorry you are struggling so much... for me every time I meet someone new I'm terrified that the things I mentioned will gross me out about them and then it won't work :( I've also got OCD and that is another factor affecting such things for me. Sorry I couldn't really offer much help with your struggles I guess I just needed to get things off my chest too! But I did read your post and I do care.
 

Rui

Karamatsu Boy
Administrator
I for one don't find it tiresome to hear about your journey, Lemon, and if anyone else does they can just... not read those posts. So please go ahead and do whatever you need to do to get your thoughts straight in your head. It's a grieving process, almost, and very relatable. I have been in a similar place myself once and I don't know what to advise other than time. It will get better. But it is a journey, and you are going to get to that better place on your own, in your own time. Being proactive and meeting other people is a great approach because it's creating opportunities even if they don't all work out.

There are a few moments in life where you lose something and think that you will never experience anything that replaces that amazing thing you had. It can be a relationship (romantic or otherwise) or an experience. But the human heart is a strange thing, and it can be surprising in its ability to expand to learn new ways to love and trust. The relationships you have in future won't ever be the same as the old ones and mourning that is a hard process. They will eventually be better. Because you will have have learnt from the past and grown as a person, and you will be better positioned to handle the unfair situations that life throws out. Just make sure that you aren't self-sabotaging before you make objective choices about this new girl (and any other future partners you find on Tinder). Depression loves to set things up so that turning back towards despair looks as though it's the only possible solution. Breaking out of that cycle is enormously important.

RadFemHedonist, that sucks that you aren't allowed to talk to your friend any more. It feels rather controlling on his new partner's side, honestly, though I don't know their circumstances. If you've had that spark once I'm sure you'll get to that same place again when the time comes, and it sounds as though you meant a lot to your friend even though the relationship didn't go where you wanted. It sounds as though you are some flavour of demiromantic which is contributing to the huge gap in your experience with that friend compared to your other relationships, where it was harder to look past the discomfort? In any case, I hope that this new girlfriend will loosen the leash eventually. Losing out on a good friendship on top of the romance makes both of these situations all the more painful to read about.

I'm rooting for you both.

R
 
Thanks so much Rui I think honestly it's really just body discomfort though, from what I've read of your experiences it might be hard for you to understand as I think we think and feel differently about this but I tend to fall for people romantically quite a lot or at least I used to before I got rly jaded but that sense of discomfort with certain aspects of most human bodies has always been there, there have also been people who I've been FWB with where I generally enjoyed the sex but would refuse to kiss them because their breath smelled and/or their mouth was too wet, hopefully that helps give a bit of a clearer picture of my issues. I also just generally am quite particular about stuff in my mouth which you can imagine that being an issue when it comes to sex in a not infrequent number of cases, like I have sensory issues around food and chewing and swallowing food as well.

Also, I do really care what my partner looks like physically like not that I'm mean to people who don't look attractive to me but it does make it harder cuz otherwise I just don't get turned on and there's no point (not that I think physical attraction or sex is all a relationship is but it is vitally important for me, I kinda admire you for not being as fussed about that tbh but I know I can't change who I am and ultimately I think it's important to be myself and not try to force myself to change, I've actually had some pretty bad experiences cuz I tried to force myself to go out with people I wasn't attracted to and I still feel bad that some of them got hurt emotionally by that too :( which is part of why I think the incel mentality is so dangerous cuz that is what happened when I thought they might be right that "women are/I am too picky" :( ).

Thankyou so much for your thoughtful reply I can see you put care and effort into it :) I'm kind of a bit like, there's always some cute guy or another who works in a local coffee shop or supermarket or some such who I've got a bit of a soft spot for even tho I know it will never go anywhere and that while I think I'm probably one of the nicer customers they have to deal with it is their job to be nice to me and what not, it wouldn't deter me from pursuing an actually promising thing with someone who seemed genuinely interested, my point is more than I don't think I'm actually demiromantic but it's a reasonable thing that you might think that based on what I said though. One of my problems is that just out of shyness and fear of embarrassment I'm really not good at making a move when I meet someone who seems promising, I've met cute guys who I could tell were into me (one of them even said he was outright) and just didn't manage to say anything to ask for a social media way of contacting them or anything and I wish I could find a way to get past that. What you said about depression was really helpful and I'll do my best to remember it :)
 

IncendiaryLemon

Captain Karen
AUKN Staff
I for one don't find it tiresome to hear about your journey, Lemon, and if anyone else does they can just... not read those posts. So please go ahead and do whatever you need to do to get your thoughts straight in your head. It's a grieving process, almost, and very relatable. I have been in a similar place myself once and I don't know what to advise other than time. It will get better. But it is a journey, and you are going to get to that better place on your own, in your own time. Being proactive and meeting other people is a great approach because it's creating opportunities even if they don't all work out.

There are a few moments in life where you lose something and think that you will never experience anything that replaces that amazing thing you had. It can be a relationship (romantic or otherwise) or an experience. But the human heart is a strange thing, and it can be surprising in its ability to expand to learn new ways to love and trust. The relationships you have in future won't ever be the same as the old ones and mourning that is a hard process. They will eventually be better. Because you will have have learnt from the past and grown as a person, and you will be better positioned to handle the unfair situations that life throws out. Just make sure that you aren't self-sabotaging before you make objective choices about this new girl (and any other future partners you find on Tinder). Depression loves to set things up so that turning back towards despair looks as though it's the only possible solution. Breaking out of that cycle is enormously important.

RadFemHedonist, that sucks that you aren't allowed to talk to your friend any more. It feels rather controlling on his new partner's side, honestly, though I don't know their circumstances. If you've had that spark once I'm sure you'll get to that same place again when the time comes, and it sounds as though you meant a lot to your friend even though the relationship didn't go where you wanted. It sounds as though you are some flavour of demiromantic which is contributing to the huge gap in your experience with that friend compared to your other relationships, where it was harder to look past the discomfort? In any case, I hope that this new girlfriend will loosen the leash eventually. Losing out on a good friendship on top of the romance makes both of these situations all the more painful to read about.

I'm rooting for you both.

R

Thank you Rui, I appreciate your words as always. I never really thought about it, but I suppose it is a bit of a grieving process. She isn't gone, but she is gone from my life for the foreseeable future, and though I'm over the worst of it, it still impacts my life a lot to this day. Being proactive is good, yes, but I feel like this first try kind of put me off a little bit. I feel like this girl was one in a million, lightning in a bottle, and no matter how bad it is for me to say, every other girl I try and date will inevitably be compared to her, and I'm just not sure anyone else would match up. Then again, perhaps I'm just putting her on a pedestal a bit too much. I can't help but feel there's a part of me that's overblowing how amazing she was to me that's holding me back from meeting other people, yet I still feel like that attraction was totally genuine. I know it probably sounds contradictory but I feel like I'm in a bit of a mental battle against myself at the minute.

I feel like I'm gonna pump the brakes on Tinder. The app itself is a one way ticket to feeling bad about yourself anyway, essentially giving you an insight into just how many women reject you (in my case, most of them) almost entirely based on looks. It's like a self esteem black hole. I've had a few good experiences with it, but it's not really worth the effort. I feel if I meet someone again, I want it to be natural like last time. Tinder just has this context of a forced conversation almost. Last time, through Twitter, there was no pressure really, or pre-tense of wanting to be anything more than just friends like there is on dating apps, and I think that made it a lot easier for me to talk to her, and form a close bond, even if it didn't pan out.

As I've said before, the loss of a friendship that I cared about so much is just as big a loss to me, if not more so, than any potential romance. It's a shame these things are intertwined so much, you can try your best to 'just be friends' but if that attraction and love is there, it's almost impossible to beat down, and to do so is just incredibly draining. It's like you're just outright lying to the person, but if you tell the truth, you risk losing them or hurting them. It's a tightrope that's just too hard to walk, yet too painful to get off if you're not forced to.

@RadFemHedonist I'm sorry to hear you ended up in a similar boat, it's terrible. I totally understand where you're coming from, I'd never felt a kind of rapport I'd felt with her either, our friendship felt so good, and she'd always tell me how much she loved me and cared about me and how I made her smile. It was good at the time, but obviously didn't last. Like Rui says, it sounds like his new girlfriend could do with putting a bit more trust in him. I can kinda see why, if you went a bit further than just friends, but if she has any faith in him at all, that shouldn't really matter so much.

I wouldn't say that it's right to feel bad about being picky or whatever. You can only be attracted to who you are attracted to, you can't change that, and I say that as someone is, going by my experience with women, genuinely quite unattractive, generally speaking. Some people just aren't blessed with good looks, and you can't really help if most women don't find you attractive, you just have to find the handful that do!
 
IncendiaryLemon I really feel you on that about the feelings being impossible to ignore if they are there. That was how it was for me. I appreciate what you said about not feeling bad about being "picky" as well :) I have suffered from depression for years and am gradually learning ways to feel that bit brighter inside but I still have a lot of bad or at least not so good days, it's really hard and I'm so sorry if you have felt like you can't let those tears out, I know some men feel like it's shameful for them to cry and I promise you it's not. If you don't wanna cry for your own reasons that's fair enough but I just wanted to offer a reminder that you deserve to be able to cry if it helps you or if you just feel like you need to. I try and remind myself that being alive is actually a really amazing miraculous thing for a number of reasons (and I say that as an atheist!) Honestly I love life for all the flaws in the world and people, I just wish I didn't get so insecure and afraid of abandonment (which is a legitimate thing for me to be feeling and yes people can really suck but I wanna try and move past it). I think you're wise to leave Tinder be if it is making you feel that way, I have had a lot of men match with me on there only to never reply when I messaged them or just send messages that make apparent that all they want is sex, and I often have similar experiences on other ostensibly less hookup focused dating apps, so honestly I feel something of your pain there too (I suspect some of the men who match with me are actually just bots as well). It's amazing how good unrequited love can feel for all the pain that can come from it! And I think it can leave one feeling like some kind of masochist who is incapable of actually mutually loving someone and is in love with the idea of love rather than the person they love unrequitedly? But I would advise similarly as Rui does that if you like the girl you went out with don't be too quick to give up. I can't make that call for you but "lovely" sounds like it could lead to something good :) But I don't wanna be that person trying to push you into something if it just doesn't feel right. I wish you the best of luck with it all :)

Both you and Rui are right to point out that it's a bit understandable why his girlfriend is worried but I would never try to steal him away from her I just want to be able to talk to him again cuz he's my friend. Yet sometimes I think that it is really best for me to move on and tbf some of the advice he gave me was terrible and that I'm glad to be without. I really wish I had a boyfriend sometimes and then other times I think I'm lucky to be free! Honestly I'm glad I'm not still completely crushed under the weight of missing him, though it does feel a bit like I'm betraying my feelings for him in that. And I get what you're saying about comparing other people to that person. Sorry if this post was too rambly.
 

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