What is love? (split from the AF17 thread)

Vashdaman

Vashdaman

Za Warudo
If you are in love does that mean you are sure without a shadow of a doubt that this is the person you wan't to spend the rest of the life with and can't imagine it any other way? or does the "grass is always greener"syndrome always strike, meaning we simply have to train our minds out of such strayful thoughts?
 
You fall in love, you fall back out of love. Repeat ad infinitum. I don't think love does endure. It's fleeting, like happiness. Or eating a sandwich.
 
I think it depends on the individual people involved. I have never for a minute had any desire for greener grass, but then I have always been a very serious (and dull) person in that regard!

R
 
Thanks for the input peeps!

@ Ayase

I assume your just talking about romantic love? I don't think love is fleeting but romantic love, well there's all kind of different opinion's on that. But it's interesting, your views that romantic love is fleeting is kind of in line with certain spiritual masters who consider romantic love just an unrealistic distraction from the true goal....I think it just depends on the person though to be honest, we're all here to have different experiences. Although it is quite true that in the west we do get the ideal of ultimate romantic love ingrained into our brains from day one, which is probably why I am the way I am lol.

@ Rui

See, thats what I would love to have! I too am also very serious about the things I do (but try not to take myself too seriously?) yet I guess the thing that always bothers me is whether I should naturally feel that sense certainly about "the one" or whether I just need to work at it.
 
On the occasions it's quiet and I actually stop to think about it, I tend to be of the opinion that everything we do is a distraction. Not from a goal as such but from the final, ultimate truth that everything in existence will eventually belong to the void.

I can only love things / people for a finite (and usually short) period of time. Not always through my choice, but that's what happens. They don't reciprocate, or I get bored, or they they start to piss me off. F*ckin' people and their goddamn unwritten rules of social interaction. F*ckin' rules full stop...
 
ayase said:
On the occasions it's quiet and I actually stop to think about it, I tend to be of the opinion that everything we do is a distraction. Not from a goal as such but from the final, ultimate truth that everything in existence will eventually belong to the void.

I can only love things / people for a finite (and usually short) period of time. Not always through my choice, but that's what happens. They don't reciprocate, or I get bored, or they they start to piss me off. F*ckin' people and their goddamn unwritten rules of social interaction. F*ckin' rules full stop...
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Well once again it could be said that your views overlap with certain spiritual lines of though albiet worded slightly different. Many masters believe the only way to reach liberation is to devolve your mind slowly until it gets the point of total emptiness, free from all seeds of thought. Or in other words making your mind void so you can fully become one with god.

I also think you may also like certain Taoist teachings, as a big theme is the need to get back to nature and abandon all forms of civilized society and social structure, and allowing yourself to partake in spontaneous natural action which at times may serve no logical purpose (which is why it was in many ways the opposite of a Confucian school of thought). Once again the goal being a kind of devolving of sorts.
 
ayase said:
I tend to be of the opinion that everything we do is a distraction. Not from a goal as such but from the final, ultimate truth...
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Seriously though, it can be quite difficult to deal with people at times, especially when you're dealing with relationships.
I would have to separate the 2 types of love to what has already been mentioned. I see romantic love as a craving for a physical or emotional partnership, where the ups and downs are the high-lights of that type of relationship. The connection there is purely of desire - a type of lustfulness that isn't necessarily sexual, but you want to go on romantic meals, watch a sunset, be "dangerous" in public areas. It's looking for the hype that's there being with someone, the thrill of interacting with another.

But that may be the bridge to lead on to something else, or to fade into a memory. And if the relationship continues and there isn't much more to learn of each other and you feel like you've "done it all" (which isn't true), but you're happy to sit in bed and talk and you deal with problems on a daily basis without needing to express too much. That's the love I see that's not romantic, but it's a much stronger tie that says "you know you love them for who they are, just for being there."
Sure, you need the odd thrill to make both of you happy - remembering anniversaries, the trip to another country together - just to let the romance flow. Other than that though, I think if you really wish to be with them, you dont have to go the extra mile all the time. Just let them know you still care.
And on that note, we need to remember this:
http://animeaxeeffect.ytmnd.com/
 
animefreak17 said:
hey if your going to debate about rules and society and such do it in a nother forum
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Wow. It seems there is at least one taboo topic in the Casa del'AF.

I think there are indeed different kinds of love, I think true love never really goes away, it may morph into platonic love but you will still have strong feelings for that person that you were in love with. If it goes away quickly then in all likelihood it might just have been a crush.
 
Yeah I agree real love never goes away. I guess my trouble is whether I should be aiming to find the kind of romantic love where I feel "OMG, this the the one, I never even want to look at another female form ever again!", or whether thats just idealistic fantasy and in time the doubts I have will just pass.

Maybe it is just a case of "the grass is always greener" and its just the desires my ego pure and simple. Yet as I type this I'm still thinking "theres someone out there who I haven't met yet who is the one, who my whole spirit will resonate with".But maybe it just boils down to sexual attraction in reality (although I would never just settle for sexual attraction alone,its got to be everything), although I don't think its just that.

Or maybe its just that my standards are ludicrously high?
 
vashdaman said:
...it could be said that your views overlap with certain spiritual lines of though albiet worded slightly different.
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I love that line. Spiritual teachers tend to use slightly less profanity, don't they? But I approve of how you have me pegged as some kind of needlessly antagonistic philosopher. That's the image I try to cultivate.

@Sparrow - I'm pretty sure real love can go away as well. How would you deal with rejection otherwise? It can "become platonic love" sure, if a relationship comes to an end through mutual agreement in an amicable fashion. Unfortunately most don't. They end with one person still loving the other but the feeling no longer being reciprocated. Thus the love has already gone away for one person, and the other has to stop loving as well (or become a stalker, whatever you think is healthier).

If you think we can only call a feeling which endures "love" you would have to wait until at least one party involved had died, then conclusively verify that they had never been unfaithful. Then, and only then, could what they had be declared "love". I think I'll stick to classifying love as something which can come to an end...

Edit: I have to agree with af17, this conversation is way too deep for this thread. Somebody split it off please.
 
ayase said:
You fall in love, you fall back out of love. Repeat ad infinitum. I don't think love does endure. It's fleeting, like happiness. Or eating a sandwich.
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One freaking expensive sandwhich! Am I Right!
 
ayase said:
vashdaman said:
...it could be said that your views overlap with certain spiritual lines of though albiet worded slightly different.
Click to expand...
I love that line. Spiritual teachers tend to use slightly less profanity, don't they? But I approve of how you have me pegged as some kind of needlessly antagonistic philosopher. That's the image I try to cultivate.

@Sparrow - I'm pretty sure real love can go away as well. How would you deal with rejection otherwise? It can "become platonic love" sure, if a relationship comes to an end through mutual agreement in an amicable fashion. Unfortunately most don't. They end with one person still loving the other but the feeling no longer being reciprocated. Thus the love has already gone away for one person, and the other has to stop loving as well (or become a stalker, whatever you think is healthier).

If you think we can only call a feeling which endures "love" you would have to wait until at least one party involved had died, then conclusively verify that they had never been unfaithful. Then, and only then, could what they had be declared "love". I think I'll stick to classifying love as something which can come to an end...

Edit: I have to agree with af17, this conversation is way too deep for this thread. Somebody split it off please.
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You make a good point, but I still don't think that love goes away, you just bury it and if you don't see the person very often that's generally much easier to do. I guess I just think that way because I'm still friends with the two girls I've been in love with. One of them's my best friend now in fact. I do think that relationships shouldn't just be thrown away after a break up if you can help it. I mean you obviously have a lot in common with this person so why not continue it?

That's all I wanted to say.

New topic: What's the deal with mini magnums? They're ****ing tiny now, barely a mouthful and still stupidly pricey.
 
I LOVE Magnums. :p

I never bothered with them... But I cant stop and say no to a double caramel. At least they given you enough to gorge on.

Moving swiftly on - Do you have days when you just dont look you're best? (Since we want to skip subjects so quickly).
 
Day when I don't look my best!??? My dear friend I am the best!

Sorry, enough kissing my own arse.

@Sparrow

Yep I agree with you. I personally would also go as far as to say that when we make love to someone, it is something we should take very seriously as this is one of the most intimate things two human beings can do and as such does create a certain bond. For this reason I don't believe sex should be treated casually, I think it really does link the two bodies together in a deep way. I think the native Americans (I think it was them?) believe that when two people make love there spirits and bodies are connected together for something like 5 years. I wouldn't actually go that far myself, and we do all make mistakes and I think sometimes we just need to move on, but nonetheless I think there is truth to it.

But yeah I'm kinda old school.

Funnliy enough this was also touched on a little bit in a Japanese book I read recently Mistress Oriku. She believes in maintaning a strong relationship with all the men she sleeps with due to the intimacy of the act. Ironically she also has rampant one night stands and sleeps with a new guy every chapter, but still.

Anyway sorry for carrying on the philosopical debate on love in this tread. Animefreak bruv come drop us a gem.
 
vashdaman said:
Day when I don't look my best!??? My dear friend I am the best!

Sorry, enough kissing my own arse.

@Sparrow

Yep I agree with you. I personally would also go as far as to say that when we make love to someone, it is something we should take very seriously as this is one of the most intimate things two human beings can do and as such does create a certain bond. For this reason I don't believe sex should be treated casually, I think it really does link the two bodies together in a deep way. I think the native Americans (I think it was them?) believe that when two people make love there spirits and bodies are connected together for something like 5 years. I wouldn't actually go that far myself, and we do all make mistakes and I think sometimes we just need to move on, but nonetheless I think there is truth to it.

But yeah I'm kinda old school.

Funnliy enough this was also touched on a little bit in a Japanese book I read recently Mistress Oriku. She believes in maintaning a strong relationship with all the men she sleeps with due to the intimacy of the act. Ironically she also has rampant one night stands and sleeps with a new guy every chapter, but still.

Anyway sorry for carrying on the philosopical debate on love in this tread. Animefreak bruv come drop us a gem.
Click to expand...

Certainly not current native americans *bud dum tish* but I agree with that, I think sex isn't something you should have on a whim, it should mean something definitely.

@Chaz yes certainly, usually when the weather's bad I don't feel I look my best. Possibly a link there, I suspect it comes down to the mood you're in.
 
To quote the great Mae West: "Sex with love is the greatest thing in life. But sex without love - that's not so bad either."

Sex is as deep as you want it to be*. It can be a special, emotional thing or it can just be fun. I think presuming it has to be a special thing every time is putting a lot of pressure on yourself and your partner(s). Personally, I'm happy to take what I can get (which probably makes it worse that that's not a lot). I think if you have managed to stay friends with former lovers then you've been very lucky Sparrow. I don't think that's most people's experience.



*Not an intentional double-entendre... But I like it.
 
Yeah, I didn't mean everytime you sex it should be special, as of course it can just be pure kinky fun and nothing more. I meant more that I myself personally am just more careful about who I have sex with, as I personally do think it does connect the energies (and maybe spirit) of the people together for a period, and I only want to connect like that with someone I know and I think is right. I'm not saying if you wake up tomorrow in bed with someone after a alcohol induced romp you should start worrying (actually that depends...), but I think it is something we should try and be mindful of.
 
Relationships are sometimes the easiest things in the world, and at other times the most hassle you've had in times and generally would rather be alone.

As such, lastnight when i got back home i proceeded to create a facebook event for people to come to my house this saturday, to attend my BBQ and partying weekend (mates 20th birthday on friday, BBQ sunday and then full english breakfast sunday for hangovers) The other week i went to my mates house (who's birthday is on the friday) for his sister and dads birthday, so i decided to invite both my friend and his sister (who's just turned 18)

My gf's sister and boyfriend (whom we went to Egypt with) are both invited too. The gf called me at 1am this morning to say "why have i invited leos sister?" i explained that i was just being nice because they invited me to her and her dads bday the other week, the gf saw this as weird. I said "if i had feeling for her or if she was an ex then i'd see the problem, but as neither apply just what the hell are you moaning about?" which sort of caught her off guard, she said "why haven't you invited all my sisters then?" - because the one we went on holiday with is over 18 AND responsible/mature, the rest are 17 (though has the maturity of a 14 year old) and 15 (with the maturity of a 19 year old but she's not 18 so i'm not giving her alcohol again, i got moaned at last time)

To me there was no problem, to the gf she kept saying its weird... sometimes in relationships one side will voice something and the other won't like it or understand why its even a issue to bring up. The phrase "can't live with 'em, can't live without 'em" comes straight to mind.

Though we both know that despite little chats like that, we don't argue about it because i don't hold back and neither does she and neither wants to hurt each other so there's no point arguing, we just talk it over.

**** i've just realised that i've wrote another essay *facepalms*

Basically what i'm saying is - 2 humans, capable of so much - think one in the same and at the same time worlds apart. Capable of both love and hate, its a work in progress for two people to live together. But fully worth it, when everythings going well its perfect, when the bad times come then its always better to talk it through than to shout to the rooftops about it.

As for sex, foreplay can be the bane of mens lives but its worth it in the long run if you know what i mean haha
 
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