CLIMATEGATE!!! The Global Warming Agenda exposed.

The media using misleading terminology. *SHOCK*

Outlaw i can't help but feel ur wasting ur energy. People believe what they want to believe. Humanity has so much guilt that it wants to believe that its changing the climate and destroying the earth. Its just too believable that this is just another way humanity is effing the planet in the A.
 
can i ask why the climate change program is a bad thing?

ignoring the things that could be natural

cleaning up the air, reducing rubish, presevering nature

why are any of these a bad thing?
 
well its not... that was kind of my earlier point.

These are things we should be doing anyway. So is the lie justified?

None of the benefits would ever happen unless theres a global threat to give humanity the kick up the **** it needs to clean up its act.
 
skikes said:
The media using misleading terminology. *SHOCK*

Outlaw i can't help but feel ur wasting ur energy. People believe what they want to believe. Humanity has so much guilt that it wants to believe that its changing the climate and destroying the earth. Its just too believable that this is just another way humanity is effing the planet in the A.
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I know they believe what they want to believe, believe me, thats cool, but when your getting your beliefs fed to you by someone who doestint have your interests at heart, without at least actively questioning it, its manufactured belief, Im not saying dont believe it, or tht you should believe this, or even that you or anyone should even listen to me, but just to see the world from multiple perspectives, its not al black and white.
Obvious statement I know, but not enough people actively give a crap in my opinion and not in the snes that they should, but in the sense they should realise they can.

Oh and just because something isint shocking doeint take away its significance, listen Im not here trying to convert anyone to anything, Ive actually just been rolling with the topic, its gone a different directin than I planned, I dont believe humanity has any sort of large guilt whatsoever, most people just dont give a crap, thats not guilt.
 
Ryo Chan said:
can i ask why the climate change program is a bad thing?

ignoring the things that could be natural

cleaning up the air, reducing rubish, presevering nature

why are any of these a bad thing?
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Hey Hitler sounded like a great idea too didint he, look what happened there, concepts are all well and good, its who is behind those concepts and to what end is their smokescreen of justice toward.
History shows us that two faced agendas are not the exception, but the rule, in hgih level politics

No-one is disagreeing that being environmentally aware is a good thing, but thats not what we are being told, we are being told that co2 is a pollutant, which is utter insanity, its a complete mis-representation of the truth, it is one of the building blocks of life.
 
Ryo Chan said:
we were told invading iraq was a good idea, and look how that's going, it happens all the time, get use to it, nothing else you can do
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Yes we were, but millions knew it WASINT a good idea,
Theres plenty you can do, educating yourself on a situation from all perspectives is one of them, and is because something happens often indicative that you should just roll over and die?

Not in my eyes, the people have had many victories over big government in the past and are continuing to do so, Im not campaigning for some sort of utopia where everyone knows everything, but for the love of god, lets not just give up and subject later generations to what we couldint be bothered to stand up to, and I dont mean that in the violent revolutionary sense, almost every revolution in history ws a carefully orchestrated political play anyway, I mean a revolution of ideas, nothing lasts forever, but is that an excuse to as I said roll over and die?
 
Outlawstar said:
I apologise, what I meant to say more clearly is these are the scientists the IPCC and UN cite with a large body of their publications and are heavily affiliated with them, it is one o the top climate research centres in the world, stop tip-toeing around the issue now please.
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You are the one clutching at straws. Those (very few) scientists are not affiliated with the U.N. nor with the IPCC. They are not paid by those organisations, they are subsidised by those organisations. Stop misleading people, please.

What are you talking about, this has been reported in every newspaper you listed as respectable, except the Independant I think.
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Yes, most news organisations have reported on this unethical behaviour. But the only ones who draw the conclusion that all of the evidence that proves anthropogenic climate change is real is rendered as false or even suspicious are right-wing "news" outlets that have always been desperate to deny climate change because it means they would have to radically alter their principals and ideals. Do you understand this point yet? Do you understand that the only news sources that conclude that climate change is a sinister scam orchestrated by the world's scientists are right-wing and biased?

Im just wondering, do you believe that the earth is currently warming and that emmisions of co2 is the prime cause?
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I believe that the climate is changing (not just warming) and that human pollution is to blame, most certainly. Neither you nor I are scientists, however, and so you cannot proclaim greater knowledge on this subject than I. I simply choose to believe 99.9% of the world's researchers, scientists and intellectuals, you choose to believe 0.01% of the world's scientists and 100% of the world's paranoid conspiracy theorists and 100% of the world's biased right-wing opinion pieces.
 
You are the one clutching at straws. Those (very few) scientists are not affiliated with the U.N. nor with the IPCC. They are not paid by those organisations, they are subsidised by those organisations. Stop misleading people, please.
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They are one of the major bodies the IPCC and UND draw upon and credit with their data, affiliation much?


Yes, most news organisations have reported on this unethical behaviour. But the only ones who draw the conclusion that all of the evidence that proves anthropogenic climate change is real is rendered as false or even suspicious are right-wing "news" outlets that have always been desperate to deny climate change because it means they would have to radically alter their principals and ideals. Do you understand this point yet? Do you understand that the only news sources that conclude that climate change is a sinister scam orchestrated by the world's scientists are right-wing and biased?
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If you dont want to look at it and make you OWN conclusions based on knowledge of the topic at hand, that would be nice.
Unethical is unethical, regardless of ones conclusion of teh act in question.


I
believe that the climate is changing (not just warming) and that human pollution is to blame, most certainly. Neither you nor I are scientists, however, and so you cannot proclaim greater knowledge on this subject than I. I simply choose to believe 99.9% of the world's researchers, scientists and intellectuals, you choose to believe 0.01% of the world's scientists and 100% of the world's paranoid conspiracy theorists and 100% of the world's biased right-wing opinion pieces.
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Your knowledge on this topic is clearly lesser than mine touting such unreasonable numbers as that, also WE ALL KNOW THAT HUMANS POLLUTE THE ENVIRONMENT, I dont know how many times I have to say that, and give yourself a pat on the back, you think the climate is changing, but the problem is, we are not talking about climate change in general here, we are talking about AGW, that is what Copenhagen is ultimately about, while of course we will continue to cut down football fields of trees each day, and create county sized dead zones in the seas unchecked, seeing a conflict of interests here?

Do you even understand what Copenhagen is, its the most pointless treaty ever to be made if it passes, even assuming co2 does warm the earth, which it doesint, the goals of the treaty do absolutoly NOTHING to abate the output to any meaningful level when you factor in the developing nations like China and India, who dont have to fully adhere, it is POINTLESS, there is NO tangible benefit except an idealogical one, teh only benefit is a new billion dollar industry through carbon taxes!!!
 
You are making the conclusion that all of the proof for man-made climate change is falsified, resulting from the collusion of a vast majority of the world's scientists in some kind of sinister plot. And you're using right-wing news sources to back up this conclusion, and make it seem less nutty than it really is. You're not operating logically and reasonably if you think it's ok to make such an enormous claim based on such a small incident.
 
CitizenGeek said:
You are making the conclusion that all of the proof for man-made climate change is falsified, resulting from the collusion of a vast majority of the world's scientists in some kind of sinister plot. And you're using right-wing news sources to back up this conclusion, and make it seem less nutty than it really is. You're not operating logically and reasonably if you think it's ok to make such an enormous claim based on such a small incident.
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I said it before and Ill say it again, I am not talking about climate change, we are taking about AGW due to carbon emissions, I am making a conclusion based on the fact that the Earth is cooling, based on the farcicle tactics of Al Gore and the IPCC who have fudged data and outright lied, based on the higher levels of CO2 in the past, based on the fact it was hotter during the Medievil Warm period,, based on the fact that when surveyed many IPCC scientists themselves admit that the predicted warming woudlint be catastrophic in any way, based on the Suns unusual quietness in concert with unusually cold global temperatures of late, based on the outright lies and propoganda desseminated to the public in regards to AGW, and now based on the fact that the leaked e-mails and documents which have been confirmed as real by those who wrote them, though the media are somehow trying to spin that, clearly show collusion to hide data and to silence others who would challenge that view.

Oh and did I mention more co2 is better for agriculture and the planet as a bioshere.

And even if I am wrong on my current stance, which I could well be, refer to my previous post where I laid out exactly why its a pointless treaty anyway, its utterly pointless, and to tax teh public and buisness on carbon as the treaty lays out, is facicle if the basis of AGW is wrong and biased, not to mention the transfer of wealth in the form of climate debt, which is even more of a joke in the form of 2-10percent annual GDP depending of the nations stature and all in the midst of such a serious depression.

Aargh, its just illogical, you must at least agree on that.
 
No, carbon taxes are a good idea. We know that CO2 causes damage. Even if you delude yourself into thinking climate change as caused by humans is just a conspiracy, there is still a good argument about all the damage CO2 does.
 
CO2, in moderation is good for the plants, but an excessive amount would cause the planet to become like a greenhouse

the trick is to make things more efficient, such as hydrogen fuel cells for cars, but of course that would be expensive and the government doesn' like thins expensive
 
CitizenGeek said:
No, carbon taxes are a good idea. We know that CO2 causes damage. Even if you delude yourself into thinking climate change as caused by humans is just a conspiracy, there is still a good argument about all the damage CO2 does.
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So even in light of the fact that emissions will not abate in any meaningful way, you still believe we should tax the public and corporations for something there is a "good argument" for.
 
Outlawstar said:
Is there no-one on this planet that you love?
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Myself. My mum maybe...

It's fun to watch the debate. New challengers stepped in.

The levels of CO2 that are "good" for the planet, it possibly just the level of CO2 we emit by simply living. Any more than that I don't think it is.

My word and Nyani's word on health issues that CO2 in the air can cause is no good to make you beleive CO2 is a bad thing and when I say you're just having a go at people here, without proof (I mean, where is the proof of this global cooling? The word of those two scientists are as good as nothing to me, they lied about GW? They could be lyiing right now abotu this global cooling, I still believe that there is more money to be made by not taxing CO2 emissions.

Increased production output is WAY more benefiting to economy and makes a lot more money than restricting things. How does CO2 taxes collected compares to a the income taxes collected in a 1% increase of the GDP?
 
Just in case anyone did believe the hysterical rantings and misinformation expressed by Outlawstar and backed up by his fellow paranoid/duplicitous right-wing media; this article explains why "ClimateGate" is a complete non-scandal.
 
CitizenGeek said:
Just in case anyone did believe the hysterical rantings and misinformation expressed by Outlawstar and backed up by his fellow paranoid/duplicitous right-wing media; this article explains why "ClimateGate" is a complete non-scandal.
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They aren't gonna admit they've been bullshitting us all the time, are they now? They're obviously gonna cover their back with whatever **** they can.
 
CitizenGeek said:
Who's "they"? The Huffington Post is news aggregator, not the IPCC or the U.N. or Al Gore.
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They quote "RealClimate", who seem far to similar to "ClimateGate" to be unrelated. Do prove me wrong though- I just can't be bothered to look 'em up right now.

I'm saying that "RealClimate/ClimateGate" aren't going to admit to manipulating evidence.
 
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