CLIMATEGATE!!! The Global Warming Agenda exposed.

CitizenGeek said:
Just in case anyone did believe the hysterical rantings and misinformation expressed by Outlawstar and backed up by his fellow paranoid/duplicitous right-wing media; this article explains why "ClimateGate" is a complete non-scandal.


Oh man thats such a blatantly ass covering article, wow, haha, a non-scandal, so I suppose the IPCC are going to launch an investigation on a non scandal then yeah, it is of course a farce they are investigation it in the first place, US conressmen like senator inhoe has called for an investigation, Phil Jones has temporarily stepped down and Former advisor to Margaret Thatcher Lord Monkton is calling for criminal charges, non scandal indeed.


They picked out the e-mails here that are open to interpretation, this article is nothing more than a last ditch attempt to save the skins of those in a position to profit handsomely from AGW, this article is actually rife with misrepresentation of data aswell, which Im sure you know, unless, drumroll, you havint actually read the e-mails yourself.
 
The levels of CO2 that are "good" for the planet, it possibly just the level of CO2 we emit by simply living. Any more than that I don't think it is.

Unfortunately thats not true.

My word and Nyani's word on health issues that CO2 in the air can cause is no good to make you beleive CO2 is a bad thing and when I say you're just having a go at people here, without proof (I mean, where is the proof of this global cooling? The word of those two scientists are as good as nothing to me, they lied about GW? They could be lyiing right now abotu this global cooling, I still believe that there is more money to be made by not taxing CO2 emissions.

Why would I believe CO2 is a bad thing?
Just to say no one has provided any proof against me, but of course if you guys actually kept up with climate data youd know that 2008s cooling trend was such that it whitewashed all previous warming in the recent warming trend, which is now over, and surprise surprise, that big ole ball in the sky is at its QUIetest in decades. Shock Horror.

Get your coats on boys and girls.
[url=http://wattsupwiththat.com/20...ttsupwiththat.com/2008/02/19/j ... 12-months/[/url]
[url=http://uk.reuters.com/article....reuters.com/article/idUKPEK16 ... 2020080204[/url]

http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=88520025

http://www.scoop.co.nz/stories/SC0901/S00017.htm


I can post far more sources if anyone would like, to sum up here, CO2 is rising, temperature is dropping, hmm.









Increased production output is WAY more benefiting to economy and makes a lot more money than restricting things. How does CO2 taxes collected compares to a the income taxes collected in a 1% increase of the GDP?

I dont know why but I not following here.




Anyway I thought Id leave you with some interesting quotes.


"The common enemy of humanity is man.
In searching for a new enemy to unite us, we came up
with the idea that pollution, the threat of global warming,
water shortages, famine and the like would fit the bill. All these
dangers are caused by human intervention, and it is only through
changed attitudes and behavior that they can be overcome.
The real enemy then, is humanity itself."

- Club of Rome,
premier environmental think-tank,
consultants to the United Nations



"We need to get some broad based support,
to capture the public's imagination...
So we have to offer up scary scenarios,
make simplified, dramatic statements
and make little mention of any doubts...
Each of us has to decide what the right balance
is between being effective and being honest."

- Prof. Stephen Schneider,
Stanford Professor of Climatology,
lead author of many IPCC reports



“The models are convenient fictions
that provide something very useful.”

- Dr David Frame,
climate modeler, Oxford University




"It doesn't matter what is true,
it only matters what people believe is true."

- Paul Watson,
co-founder of Greenpeace




Time to wake up and smell the cheese people.
 
Well, I'm bored and I like to read, so I thought I'd do a little digging. A little on Senator Inhofe:
As a member of the Armed Services Committee, he was among the panelists questioning witnesses about the Abu Ghraib prisoner abuse. There he made news by stating he was "outraged by the outrage" over the revelations of abuse, suggesting that shock at the crimes was more offensive than the crimes themselves. In 2006, Inhofe was one of only nine senators to vote against the Detainee Treatment Act of 2005 which prohibits "cruel, inhuman or degrading" treatment of individuals in U.S. Government custody.

Inhofe often cites the Bible as the source for his positions on various political issues.
Another article containing quotes from the senator: http://www.counterpunch.org/jackson05122004.html

Doesn't sound like a man who values truth over his own opinion to me. And as for Lord Monckton, I've seen some of his stuff before, watched a video of him on YouChube, one of a speech he gave, and several of him on (world's biggest nutjob) Glenn Beck's Fox News show where:

Monckton, in his appearance on the Glenn Beck show tonight, faced the further indignity of having John Bolton, George Bush's ambassador to the United Nations, say he was too extreme.
Full Guardian article: http://www.guardian.co.uk/environment/blog/2009/oct/30/lord-monckton-glenn-beck-copenhagen

I can't help but think that there is a conspiracy here, but that you're looking in completely the wrong direction. It is panto season after all, and I get the urge to shout They're behind you! ;)
 
ayase said:
Well, I'm bored and I like to read, so I thought I'd do a little digging. A little on Senator Inhofe:
As a member of the Armed Services Committee, he was among the panelists questioning witnesses about the Abu Ghraib prisoner abuse. There he made news by stating he was "outraged by the outrage" over the revelations of abuse, suggesting that shock at the crimes was more offensive than the crimes themselves. In 2006, Inhofe was one of only nine senators to vote against the Detainee Treatment Act of 2005 which prohibits "cruel, inhuman or degrading" treatment of individuals in U.S. Government custody.

Inhofe often cites the Bible as the source for his positions on various political issues.
Another article containing quotes from the senator: http://www.counterpunch.org/jackson05122004.html

I was merely pointing out that Inhoe among many are calling for an investigation, and that the IPCC themselves are to investigate!


Doesn't sound like a man who values truth over his own opinion to me. And as for Lord Monckton, I've seen some of his stuff before, watched a video of him on YouChube, one of a speech he gave, and several of him on (world's biggest nutjob) Glenn Beck's Fox News show where:

Monckton, in his appearance on the Glenn Beck show tonight, faced the further indignity of having John Bolton, George Bush's ambassador to the United Nations, say he was too extreme.
Full Guardian article: http://www.guardian.co.uk/environment/blog/2009/oct/30/lord-monckton-glenn-beck-copenhagen

If being too extreme is telling the truth then he is guilty!

I can't help but think that there is a conspiracy here, but that you're looking in completely the wrong direction. It is panto season after all, and I get the urge to shout They're behind you! ;)
[/quote]

Care to enlighten me?
 
What I mean is, there seems to be more of an alliance of the more right wing (I know you don't like the term and neither do I, but by that I mean laissez-faire economically liberal, socially conservative) elements - the same people who used to be in charge in the US until recently continuing their pro-corporate, anti-welfare drive to discredit the science of climate change by any means necessary, seizing on and rallying round any small mistake (deliberate or otherwise) their opponents make, all the while ignoring the much bigger glaring inaccuracies in their own arguments and making up for this fact by shouting the loudest.

"Don't look at me too closely or examine my motives, look at THEM! They LIED to you! We're not lying or making stuff up, honest. Look at them! Liars! " - It's a classic political trick, and particularly populist when your opponents don't fight back with nearly as much venom. The Angry Mob love someone who'll tear others limb from limb rather than sit down and debate rationally.
 
ayase said:
What I mean is, there seems to be more of an alliance of the more right wing (I know you don't like the term and neither do I, but by that I mean laissez-faire economically liberal, socially conservative) elements - the same people who used to be in charge in the US until recently continuing their pro-corporate, anti-welfare drive to discredit the science of climate change by any means necessary, seizing on and rallying round any small mistake (deliberate or otherwise) their opponents make, all the while ignoring the much bigger glaring inaccuracies in their own arguments and making up for this fact by shouting the loudest.

"Don't look at me too closely or examine my motives, look at THEM! They LIED to you! We're not lying or making stuff up, honest. Look at them! Liars! " - It's a classic political trick, and particularly populist when your opponents don't fight back with nearly as much venom. The Angry Mob love someone who'll tear others limb from limb rather than sit down and debate rationally.

Listen I see where your coming from, but the important thing here is to approach the situation from a neutral mindset, forget opposing dictums of thought on the political scene, this is far more than a political issue, hard data is not biased, if we can show the Earth is in fact cooling and that CO2 is having a negligible if non-existent effect on Global warming, then surely any economic measures to be implemented should be scrapped, particularly if the main proponents of such measures are to profit handsomely, this is the culmination of an Agenda put in place decades ago, we need those involved in the environmental movements and green agendas to be doing it for more reason than just to be good humans who care about the planet, we need them educated, educated on the rise of the environmental movements, just who is invested in them, and just why they are invested in them.
 
If Outlawstar is comfortable in the company of senators like Inhofe (the senior Senator from Oklahoma who quotes the Bible on the senate floor as a means of supporting his arguments) and the deranged Lord Monckton, then good for him. I prefer being in the company of people who can make their arguments without relying on a millenia-old "holy" book.
 
CitizenGeek said:
If Outlawstar is comfortable in the company of senators like Inhofe (the senior Senator from Oklahoma who quotes the Bible on the senate floor as a means of supporting his arguments) and the deranged Lord Monckton, then good for him. I prefer being in the company of people who can make their arguments without relying on a millenia-old "holy" book.

I admit I didint realise he was so religious, however I have explained I was merely pointing out that people are calling for investigations, and like I said the IPCC have said they will investigate, which of course is farcicle, and will publish the results of theirs in 2010.

I dont see how Lord Monkton is deranged, or how he is wrong, elaborate?
 
Now, time for a short musical interlude.

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And it's interesting Lord Monckton talks conspiracy, did you know he himself is a member of both the Military Order of St. John of Jerusalem and of the Sovereign Military Order of Malta? Perhaps he's just playing 'conspiracy nutter' to try and discredit the very arguments he's publicly making, and he has a laugh about it with Al Gore on MSN afterwards, that ever cross your mind?

AlBore: lol saw u on glen beck
Monckfish: u leik?
Monckfish: lol @Bolton
AlBore: lol, bolton's a real n00b.
Monckfish: He's not in on it!!!
Monckfish: I didn't know!! Almost gave myself away lol!
AlBore: lol
AlBore: like Bolton has what it takes to be NWO.
Monckfish: still, I luv this job. so much fun!
Monckfish: Sucks to be you stuck playing the straight man...
Monckfish: ...bearpig!
AlBore: STFU!

(Messing with you a little here, but all in the best of fun, I'm bored and stopped actually giving a toss long ago...) ;P
 
ayase said:
And it's interesting Lord Monckton talks conspiracy, did you know he himself is a member of both the Military Order of St. John of Jerusalem and of the Sovereign Military Order of Malta? Perhaps he's just playing 'conspiracy nutter' to try and discredit the very arguments he's publicly making, and he has a laugh about it with Al Gore on MSN afterwards, that ever cross your mind?

AlBore: lol saw u on glen beck
Monckfish: u leik?
Monckfish: lol @Bolton
AlBore: lol, bolton's a real n00b.
Monckfish: He's not in on it!!!
Monckfish: I didn't know!! Almost gave myself away lol!
AlBore: lol
AlBore: like Bolton has what it takes to be NWO.
Monckfish: still, I luv this job. so much fun!
Monckfish: Sucks to be you stuck playing the straight man...
Monckfish: ...bearpig!
AlBore: STFU!

(Messing with you a little here, but all in the best of fun, I'm bored and stopped actually giving a toss long ago...) ;P

I think you may give more of a toss than you let on^__^
 
Sometimes the horses mouth is all that will suffice^__^

In searching for a new enemy to unite us, we came up with the idea that pollution, the threat of global warming, water shortages, famine and the like would fit the bill. All these dangers are caused by human intervention, and it is only through changed attitudes and behavior that they can be overcome.The real enemy then......, is humanity itself."

- Club of Rome, premier enviromental think-tank, to the United Nations


"Isn't the only hope for the planet that the industrialized civilizations collapse? Isn't it our responsiblity to bring that about?"


- Maurice Strong, founder of the UN Environment Programme


The only hope for the world is to make sure there is not another United States. We can't let other countries have the same number of cars, the amount of industrialization, we have in the US. We have to stop these Third World countries right where they are."

- Michael Oppenheimer, Environmental Defense Fund
 
Outlawstar said:
I dont see how Lord Monkton is deranged, or how he is wrong, elaborate?

He is a right-wing zealot. He even supports the notion that Obama's birth cert is forged and that he is un-fit for the presidency. Could you find some reasonable people to support your 'cause', please? Then I might listen.
 
CitizenGeek said:
Outlawstar said:
I dont see how Lord Monkton is deranged, or how he is wrong, elaborate?

He is a right-wing zealot. He even supports the notion that Obama's birth cert is forged and that he is un-fit for the presidency. Could you find some reasonable people to support your 'cause', please? Then I might listen.

Right wing zealot? Thats the best youve got?
Still stuck in the left right paradigm I see.
I can only extrapolate from this that you consider Obama is fit for the predidency, in which case I can only assume you assume Obama to actually hold any real power over the United States.

Obama is a law-breaking figurehead, nothing more than a talking head, he signs bills, and does what hes told.
Obama, ha, the biggest joke ever to hit America, and of course an attack on Obama is an attack on blacks, ooh smart buggers these guys, very smart.
 
Outlawstar said:
I think you may give more of a toss than you let on ^__^
I have spent a lot of time thinking about and researching stuff like this, not on this particular issue it has to be said, but it interested me during a very uneventful time in my life. The main problem I have with giving a toss is this:

Outlawstar said:
"The real enemy then, is humanity itself."
I agree with it. We're f*cking useless. We can't achieve anything as a society without some selfish populist coming along and ruining it when things are starting to go in the right direction. And it keeps happening. Stalin ruined the Soviet Union, Hitler ruined the peace after WW1, Countless tin-pot dictators ruined countless post-colonial societies, Nixon ruined America and Thatcher ruined Britain*. Why? Who is to blame for the fact this continues to happen? The ones who support these people. The population. The majority. The enemy of humanity is humanity. The vast majority of people do not know what is best for them, and no amount of education will make them any less gullible or subject to peer pressure.

Let's face it, we either need to be totally ruled, or we need to be totally free. Either would be preferable to this laughable facade that is 'Democracy', which suits me, I'm a person of extremes. Of course I'd prefer freedom, but totalitarianism would almost be worth it not to have the views of mindless idiots taken into account for every decision made at government level. Because It would make me positively giddy with glee to hear the following exchange:

"Ooh, we can't have a wind farm spoiling our view."
"Do you, or do you not want electricity?"
"Yes, but..."
"Would you rather we put a coal-fired power station there instead? Or a nuclear power plant?"
"No, but..."
"Then shut the f*ck up. We're putting a wind farm there."

This is one area where I quite like China. When something needs to be done, they do it, quickly and inexpensively.

*So as not to over simplify, Both Bushes, Reagan and Harold MacMillan (probably others as well) were also major contributors to the downfall of the societies they governed for their own interests and those of their pals.
 
Outlawstar said:
"The real enemy then, is humanity itself."


I agree with it. We're f*cking useless. We can't achieve anything as a society without some selfish populist coming along and ruining it when things are starting to go in the right direction. And it keeps happening. Stalin ruined the Soviet Union, Hitler ruined the peace after WW1, Countless tin-pot dictators ruined countless post-colonial societies, Nixon ruined America and Thatcher ruined Britain. Why? Who is to blame for the fact this continues to happen? The ones who support these people. The population. The majority. The enemy of humanity is humanity.


You see thats just it, it does seem to be an endlesely perpetuatng cycle, however you have to understand that Stalin, Hittler and countless other dictators were purposely brought to power for very specific reasons, and BY THE SAME PEOPLE, the international Bankers, modern history is NOTHING more than a cover story for the clandestine activites of very select groups who if brought into the light of day would be exposed and challenged by the people, which is happeneing slowly. you see we must understand history to change the future, we must understand that the world has literally been run by the same families for hundreds of years.

Im not saying its possible and Im not advocating some sort of super peceful utopia, however when you stop and look at the problems we face ,if you look beyond the media framed version of reality, you will begin to see a VERY different world than that which has been presented, all I can say is that the key is to educate yourself, I agree that many wont listen and dont care, but thats the nature of humans, and to try and change that is to become a part of the process you despise, we cant turn to politics to change things, however many people are beggining to suspect a sinister power behind the thrown, if not fully understanding it and a grassroots ideological revolution is not completely out of reach, though I agree we are very far down the line and even concede the possibility we have reached the end of true freedom, just look at us in Europe, the Lisbon treaty shenanigan drove it home for me, we are in for a bumpy ride.







The vast majority of people do not know what is best for them, and no amount of education will make them any less gullible or subject to peer pressure.


Most people do know whats best for them, they just arent given other choices, because educatin itself is turning out zombies, and guess who owns the education sytsem, drumroll.


Let's face it, we either need to be totally ruled, or we need to be totally free. Either would be preferable to this laughable facade that is 'Democracy', which suits me, I'm a person of extremes. Of course I'd prefer freedom, but totalitarianism would almost be worth it not to have the views of mindless idiots taken into account for every decision made at government level. Because It would make me positively giddy with glee to hear the following exchange:

I cannot advocate totalitarianism, it is usually the result of an uneducated public susceptible to pre-dictatorship propoganda.

No matter what we think, we wont know until we try.

We need to take back the corporate owned media, that is the sole biggest obstacle to an educated public, that alone would be a revolution and it is hgappening and for the better, with the alternative media explosion, I personally have made lifestyle changes based on research that really doesint make it through the mainstream, and for the better.





This is one area where I quite like China. When something needs to be done, they do it, quickly and inexpensively.


Yes whether the people like it or not!!!
 
Outlawstar said:
Im not saying its possible and Im not advocating some sort of super peceful utopia, however when you stop and look at the problems we face and the endless violence we indulge in, you find it is the same people behind it
My research led me to believe it's the same type of people behind it, but it takes two types of people for any self-interested parties to gain power. First is a small group of intelligent, manipulative, leaders and second is a mass of unintelligent, unquestioning followers. Nothing bar genetic engineering will ever eliminate those two types of people occuring at roughly the same proportion over time in the population. So you will always have a few selfish leaders with many gullible followers. And I don't see a way out of that. That's just human nature, and we can't escape. Not that I don't also think we should try!
 
ayase said:
Outlawstar said:
Im not saying its possible and Im not advocating some sort of super peceful utopia, however when you stop and look at the problems we face and the endless violence we indulge in, you find it is the same people behind it
My research led me to believe it's the same type of people behind it, but it takes two types of people for any self-interested parties to gain power. First is a small group of intelligent, manipulative, leaders and second is a mass of unintelligent, unquestioning followers. Nothing bar genetic engineering will ever eliminate those two types of people occuring at roughly the same proportion over time in the population. So you will always have a few selfish leaders with many gullible followers. And I don't see a way out of that. That's just human nature, and we can't escape. Not that I don't also think we should try!

Again its a disturbingly accurate observation you make, however, to fail is no excue not to try again, and like I said, the faith in big government is waning, millions are beginning to understand the real history of Europe and the world, hundreds of amazing authors are exposing the globalists/bankers/frikin pagan lunatics for who they really are and more people are listening, there is hope my friend, and like I said, even that hope put aside, educating oneself is the first step towards living a freeer life, for instance, in Ireland we stupidly still have a known neurotoxin and corcinogen in our water supplies, flouride, I understand the history of flouride and its effects on the human body and its use in openly fascist regimes so I make an educated choice not to drink it and campaign against its use in our water supplies, soverignty of the mind is more important that anything.
 
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