CLIMATEGATE!!! The Global Warming Agenda exposed.

[Outlawstar]

Well, considering how much of the world is not surveyed and considering that the size of middle east producers reserves are top secret, I odn't really believe oil is running out.

As for the sore eye comment, I'll simply claim you don't know what you're talking about as you didn't experience this. It was noticeably reduced once the goverment down there decided to force companies to reduce emmissions. But I guess this is all anedoctal evidence as I'm possibly the only one to have experienced that.

Searched a bit and I wasn't aware of carbon taxes, but I've noticed that they were introduced almost a decade before these global warming talks came in the the political agenda.

The point is the taxes which will be a different beast than what came before, are based on a LIE, on FRAUDULENT SCIENCE, co2 does NOT increase the earths temperature, and the Earth is currently COOLING!!

The government(rather those behind it) are using this movement just as they have planned to for decades, a control mechanism on society, a regulation mechanism, more and more control, carbon footprint this and Act on CO2 that, its a load of BUNK, and the truth is now OUT, Anthropogenic global warming is utterly discredited with the revelations revealed in the documents, that the Earth is COOLING!!!!!

 

[SciFiBoy!]

dont we need to make our economy more renewable and more efficient anyway becasue fossil fuels are running out?

So yeah lets just go with the lie, great, brilliant plan!
Read the 5 trillion peak oil scam and then tell me fossil fuels are running out!

thats not what I said

I said that if the fossil fuels are running out, should we not commit to making sure we can sustain our economy without them?

if they arent running out, then can you tell me why people say they are and why oil and energy prices continue to rise.

 

[Ryo Chan]

dont we need to make our economy more renewable and more efficient anyway becasue fossil fuels are running out?

So yeah lets just go with the lie, great, brilliant plan!
Read the 5 trillion peak oil scam and then tell me fossil fuels are running out!

thats not what I said

I said that if the fossil fuels are running out, should we not commit to making sure we can sustain our economy without them?

if they arent running out, then can you tell me why people say they are and why oil and energy prices continue to rise.

they're not running out, just all the ships are parked off of Devon watching the value of petrol go up

true story

 

[Outlawstar]

dont we need to make our economy more renewable and more efficient anyway becasue fossil fuels are running out?

So yeah lets just go with the lie, great, brilliant plan!
Read the 5 trillion peak oil scam and then tell me fossil fuels are running out!

thats not what I said

I said that if the fossil fuels are running out, should we not commit to making sure we can sustain our economy without them?

if they arent running out, then can you tell me why people say they are and why oil and energy prices continue to rise.

Like I said, the book I recomended should clear that up for you, summed up though, its simply because, someone somewhere wants you to think that!!

 

[chaos]

@Nyami - thanks for the support. I understand that for anyone who didn't experience this, it might seem like an exageration, but its not.

Well, considering how much of the world is not surveyed and considering that the size of middle east producers reserves are top secret, I odn't really believe oil is running out.

As for the sore eye comment, I'll simply claim you don't know what you're talking about as you didn't experience this. It was noticeably reduced once the goverment down there decided to force companies to reduce emmissions. But I guess this is all anedoctal evidence as I'm possibly the only one to have experienced that.

Searched a bit and I wasn't aware of carbon taxes, but I've noticed that they were introduced almost a decade before these global warming talks came in the the political agenda.

The point is the taxes which will be a different beast than what came before, are based on a LIE, on FRAUDULENT SCIENCE, co2 does NOT increase the earths temperature, and the Earth is currently COOLING!!

The government(rather those behind it) are using this movement just as they have planned to for decades, a control mechanism on society, a regulation mechanism, more and more control, carbon footprint this and Act on CO2 that, its a load of BUNK, and the truth is now OUT, Anthropogenic global warming is utterly discredited with the revelations revealed in the documents, that the Earth is COOLING!!!!!

Well, I've been through the coldest winter and the hotest summer in the last few years here.

I also remember a theory that said that global warming would have the earth cool down first, as the ice on the poles would be melting bring the the temperature down, and then, after the ice was melted, the planet starts heating up.

Also, I remember reading that we are through an ice age which is ending, an this cycle is inevitable and no amount of effort would be able to restrain it.

My point telling about these theories is to say that theories abound, but there are so many variables involved that the unless weather forecast becomes precise.

Despite that, I believe whether whatever pretext used to create those laws were lies or not, CO2 emission is bad and I experienced the issues it causes.
Also, it begs the question why were these scientists lying? and so many scientist aroudn the globe as well?

How come you get political parties around the world agreeing this is an issue? If I were a politician and the opposition created a tax based on a lie, I'd let hell loose just to get his voters.

My point here is, while I don't trust politicians individually, I trust politicians to try and slaughter each other as best and hard as they can. This is enough for me to believe that they were all disinformed.

Like I said, the book I recomended should clear that up for you, summed up though, its simply because, someone somewhere wants you to think that!!

Sorry, but what sort of proof does this book have? i believe I've read somewhere that more than 60% of the world have never being surveyed for oil, without considering the underwater reservatories.

This woudl be ok for me to believe that the reservatories are not running out. Also, if they were about to be running out, I'm sure the OPEP would release the figures on an attempt to get prices as high as they could.

 

[Asdrubael]

I've been trying to tell my dad about the global warming conspiracy but he doesn't listen. I guess with so many scientists backing it and the media concentrating reports on weather that is understandable. Maybe if this goes on mainstream tv news he will listen.

I always remembered hearing that in the 80's the theory was of global cooling and I always knew about the high temperatures in the middle ages (much higher than now) heh but I was told its the rate of change in temperature that was causing concern and not the actual current temperature. Glad to see something is revealed.

Oh and I read something about all supplies of oil in a post, well I don't think oil is running out yet because there are two main types of supply. The ones we use now are a thin oil, non viscous (relatively). Some of these we have capped but still have masses of oil, its just that there is a lack of pressure which makes it not cost effective to retrieve when compared to supplies readily available with pressure. Also there are heavy oil supplies, I believe Canada has some. This is a very viscous form and will not pump easily and currently we cannot get it out but I knew people who were working on research towards that end when I worked at Schlumberger. Heh with this scare they can keep oil prices up though

 

[Outlawstar]

Well, I've been through the coldest winter and the hotest summer in the last few years here.

I also remember a theory that said that global warming would have the earth cool down first, as the ice on the poles would be melting bring the the temperature down, and then, after the ice was melted, the planet starts heating up.



Also, I remember reading that we are through an ice age which is ending, an this cycle is inevitable and no amount of effort would be able to restrain it.

My point telling about these theories is to say that theories abound, but there are so many variables involved that the unless weather forecast becomes precise.

I dont see the relevance, brought up a point about scientific fraud on a mass scale in concordance with a decades old political agenda, we dont even need to discuss global warming as such here, I know there are many theories, but you and I know that ONE has been in the famous words of Al Whore settled, and the debate is accordingly over, thats where my problem is.

Despite that, I believe whether whatever pretext used to create those laws were lies or not, CO2 emission is bad and I experienced the issues it causes.
Also, it begs the question why were these scientists lying? and so many scientist aroudn the globe as well?

More Co2 equals more plant life, which equals more animal life, whcih equals better agriculture, we have had FAR higher concentrations of CO2 in the atmosphere in the past, I am failing to see how people have swallowed that it is somehow evil, my little brothers textbook matter of factly states that co2 is a bad gas, a frikin bad gas WE BREATHE IT OUT!!!

My guess is whatever your personal experience was with co2, was probably either not due to the co2 or due to its combination ewith something else that was emitted more frequently at the time, whatever it was, its clearly not widespread in any worrying way!

How come you get political parties around the world agreeing this is an issue? If I were a politician and the opposition created a tax based on a lie, I'd let hell loose just to get his voters.

There are those who disagree in political parties, HUNDREDS, we just dont hear about it everyday on the news, cause guess what, the same interests are in charge of the media too.

Like I said, the book I recomended should clear that up for you, summed up though, its simply because, someone somewhere wants you to think that!!

Sorry, but what sort of proof does this book have? i believe I've read somewhere that more than 60% of the world have never being surveyed for oil, without considering the underwater reservatories.

This woudl be ok for me to believe that the reservatories are not running out. Also, if they were about to be running out, I'm sure the OPEP would release the figures on an attempt to get prices as high as they could.

I think youre mis-interpreting me, Im agreeing that peak oil is a myth!!

 

[Asdrubael]

Separate from global warming I think that trying to reduce pollution and increase recycling is good to do anyway. Less pollution makes a nicer world to live in and as for recycling, well I guess its in my nature to like not seeing things wasted. They could get rid of the stupid extra strict laws and the taxes they provide with it all though, they didn't used to do that but then this all ties in with with the global warming plans

To reduce CO2 ----> plant more trees

 

[Outlawstar]

Separate from global warming I think that trying to reduce pollution and increase recycling is good to do anyway. Less pollution makes a nicer world to live in and as for recycling, well I guess its in my nature to like not seeing things wasted. They could get rid of the stupid extra strict laws and the taxes they provide with it all though, they didn't used to do that but then this all ties in with with the global warming plans

Exactly, there are environmental issues FAR more imperitave that big evil life giving carbon, the kind of things that SHOULD be addressed at a big meeting like Copenhagen, ITS A JOKE!!!!!!

 

[ayase]

To reduce CO2 ----> plant more trees

Yeah, fine. Except that's not what's happening. More trees are being chopped down.

I think in the end, the evil environmentalist conspiracy to get everyone to focus on looking after our planet is likely to win out. You'll have to forgive me for continuing to think that it seems like the most ridiculously benevolent conspiracy ever.

 

[Outlawstar]

To reduce CO2 ----> plant more trees

Yeah, fine. Except that's not what's happening. More trees are being chopped down.

I think in the end, the evil environmentalist conspiracy to get everyone to focus on looking after our planet is likely to win out. You'll have to forgive me for continuing to think that it seems like the most ridiculously benevolent conspiracy ever.

Ah yes lying continuously to the public and continuusly fudging data is so benevolent, attempting to literally re-structure the way society works and gathering more and more power of enforcement to governments is so benevolent.

Using it as a pretext for less liberty is so benevolent, I am alluding to the climate bill passed in America that allows what can be equated to green police enter your home and tell you what ou can or cannot have based on carbon.

I could go on and get deeper, point is, lets not broadly label something benevolent when its clearly not!!

 

[CitizenGeek]

Your conspiracy theories really are batshit insane, Outlawstar. I've had discussions on here with you before and I know you to be .... fond (to put it politely) of conspiracy theories. It's no surprise you're overexcited about people who've always denied climate change denying it yet again.

The fact that the only "news" sources reporting on this are self-identified right-wing outlets doesn't strike as being somewhat curious? The right-wing deludes itself about many things that mess up their plan for the world (in the case of climate change, if they were to accept it as what it is, a fact, it would mean collectivist policies would have to be adopted and that big business would be impeded). There's a conspiracy here, I'll accept that. But it really isn't that global warming is a vast sinister conspiracy to - gasp! - protect the environment (the horror!), it's right-wing loons refusing to accept what is scientific fact.

 

[Outlawstar]

Your conspiracy theories really are batshit insane, Outlawstar. I've had discussions on here with you before and I know you to be .... fond (to put it politely) of conspiracy theories.

Also, the fact that the only "news" sources reporting on this are self-identified right-wing outlets doesn't strike as being somewhat curious? The right-wing deludes itself about many things that mess up their plan for the world (in the case of climate change, if they were to accept it as what it is, a fact, it would mean collectivist policies would have to be adopted and that big business would be impeded). There's a conspiracy here, I'll accept that. But it really isn't that global warming is a vast sinister conspiracy to - gasp! - protect the environment (the horror!), it's right-wing loons refusing to accept what it scientific fact.

 

[SciFiBoy!]

Your conspiracy theories really are batshit insane, Outlawstar. I've had discussions on here with you before and I know you to be .... fond (to put it politely) of conspiracy theories.

Also, the fact that the only "news" sources reporting on this are self-identified right-wing outlets doesn't strike as being somewhat curious? The right-wing deludes itself about many things that mess up their plan for the world (in the case of climate change, if they were to accept it as what it is, a fact, it would mean collectivist policies would have to be adopted and that big business would be impeded). There's a conspiracy here, I'll accept that. But it really isn't that global warming is a vast sinister conspiracy to - gasp! - protect the environment (the horror!), it's right-wing loons refusing to accept what it scientific fact.

you make a good point about the media, the BBC barely covered it (one edition of newsnight and that was it), most of the papers only had a small amount of coverage too

 

[Outlawstar]

Your conspiracy theories really are batshit insane, Outlawstar. I've had discussions on here with you before and I know you to be .... fond (to put it politely) of conspiracy theories.

Also, the fact that the only "news" sources reporting on this are self-identified right-wing outlets doesn't strike as being somewhat curious? The right-wing deludes itself about many things that mess up their plan for the world (in the case of climate change, if they were to accept it as what it is, a fact, it would mean collectivist policies would have to be adopted and that big business would be impeded). There's a conspiracy here, I'll accept that. But it really isn't that global warming is a vast sinister conspiracy to - gasp! - protect the environment (the horror!), it's right-wing loons refusing to accept what it scientific fact.

Thanks for opening with the usual dig at my character
From my knowledge youve never proven me wrong on anything Ive said, but hey thats just crazy old me talking.

As for your second point, just the fact that your still thinking in terms of the left-right paradigm tells me enough about your knowledge base.
A vast array of left and right sources have reported, lets not get into that please, its just an excuse not to take the issue at face value!

This isint my or any so called right wing theory, this is a fact!

I noticed you called climate change a fact, jeez what a genius, liek I said earlier of course climate changes, thats what it DOES!!!



As for your scientific fact?
Id advise you actually read the emails and documents before you take the word of ANY scientist in the pay of the IPCC and the UN, you admit a conspiracy, thats all Im gonna get out fo you Im sure!!


Unfortunatly I gotta go till tomoro, chat to you then.

 

[ayase]

I think in the end, the evil environmentalist conspiracy to get everyone to focus on looking after our planet is likely to win out. You'll have to forgive me for continuing to think that it seems like the most ridiculously benevolent conspiracy ever.

Ah yes lying continuously to the public and continuusly fudging data is so benevolent, attempting to literally re-structure the way society works and gathering more and more power of enforcement to governments is so benevolent.

Using it as a pretext for less liberty is so benevolent, I am alluding to the climate bill passed in America that allows what can be equated to green police enter your home and tell you what ou can or cannot have based on carbon.

Presumably, in case you have several 5000kVA Diesel Generators in your house. I imagine the target of that bill is industrial businesses and power generation, rather than the average family home. The point of laws mandating cuts in emissions is surely to make sure that emissions are actually cut? Wouldn't do much good passing a law with no method of enforcement would it? Like fox hunting in the UK, companies would just carry on polluting.

The idea that Climate Change is not man made I have some sympathy for. The idea that not only is it not man made but that it is in fact being used to other ends... besides other things I just don't see the point. It would be an incredibly convoluted way of gaining control over people. I do value my liberty Outlaw, but there are certain cases where I think the government has to intervene and do what's in the best interests of the population at large (because left to their own devices individuals wouldn't do anything about it). Like preventing people from raping and murdering each other, protecting the environment is (in my opinion) one of those things the law has to enforce.

 

[CitizenGeek]

Thanks for opening with the usual dig at my character

I never attacked your character. I said the conspiracy theories you believe in are crazy (which they are) and that, unlike most, you are clearly of the mindset that many conspiracy theories have some merit (which you do). Some people (myself included) are less likely to trust those who believe that the U.S. government toppled the twin towers on September 11th.

From my knowledge youve never proven me wrong on anything Ive said, but hey thats just crazy old me talking.

That's because you deliberately construct your arguments so that the overwhelming evidence that contradicts you still leaves some kind of a minuscule hole whereby it is still possible that you are correct if you just do your logical gymnastics. It's rather like how religious people rely on the fact that one cannot 100% disprove the existence of a deity as somehow making such a belief reasonable.

As for your second point, just the fact that your still thinking in terms of the left-right paradigm tells me enough about your knowledge base.
A vast array of left and right sources have reported, lets not get into that please, its just an excuse not to take the issue at face value!

Well, show me them then. Show me respectable papers of record like the Times of London, or the New York Times or The Guardian or the Irish Independent drawing these obscene conclusions (that climate change is a vast conspiracy by the world's scientists) from one instance of malpractice by university researchers. The only links you've provided are from the Telegraph (right-wing British paper) and The Washington Times (D.C.-based American right-wing paper, well read by Republicans). It's not just a coincidence that the only ones drawing these ridiculous conclusions are the people that have always denied climate change for political convenience.

This isint my or any so called right wing theory, this is a fact!

No, it is one case of a small number of misbehaving scientists. The assertion that all of the proof presented in favour of climate change being the result of decades and decades of humans pumping toxins into the atmosphere is thus also doctored data resulting from a vast and sinister conspiracy by the world's environmental researchers is a blatant non-sequitor.

I noticed you called climate change a fact, jeez what a genius, liek I said earlier of course climate changes, thats what it DOES!!!

You can't be serious? The climate is changing far too drastically and far too rapidly for it to be part of natural weather cycles.

As for your scientific fact?
Id advise you actually read the emails and documents before you take the word of ANY scientist in the pay of the IPCC and the UN, you admit a conspiracy, thats all Im gonna get out fo you Im sure!!

The only conspiracy I acknowledged was the conspiracy by certain right-wing Europeans and Americans to deny climate change. And I really don't appreciate your denigrating the scientists of the world. We owe them an awful lot.

 

[chaos]

From my knowledge youve never proven me wrong on anything Ive said, but hey thats just crazy old me talking.

You're hardly opened to listen to others as well. I'm not ganging up on you, keep things civil is all I ask.

The idea that Climate Change is not man made I have some sympathy for. The idea that not only is it not man made but that it is in fact being used to other ends... besides other things I just don't see the point. It would be an incredibly convoluted way of gaining control over people.

I can agree with all that (except that I believe climate change is man-made). The decimation of trees, overfishing, more poluents emission (in all three materia states, but also "ethereal" such as radio waves) - All that affects the environment. What if the increase of radio signals is what is killing bees around the world?

There are simply too many variables and too many changes happening at once for us to understand. Our science is simply not advanced enough to analyze everything that affects something, we still have to check the variables one by one.


I've said it before and I'll keep on repeating myself here. If such CO2 conspiracy existed, I trust politicians all over the world would be going at each others jugular right now.

I can only imagine the political discourse:
"In the middle of the worst economic crisis in decades, you raise business expenses with 'green taxes', when this money could actually be used to create jobs.
And now we now these 'green taxes' were based on lies. How can you even leave your house and show yourself in public?!?!"

or something like that.

I said, I don't trust politicians, but I do trust them to check each other minuciously for political advantages and something like this would give a huge power to the opposition.
The false data scandal must be investigated, that's sure. But I can't believe that yo can actually involve so many people in a lie. The few that contradict the majority in this particular case, don't have the same credentials that the other possesses.

 

[Ryo Chan]

70 of climate change is NOT man made

the earths rotation around the sun changes, it's a proven fact, and the earth WILL move further away from the sun sooner or later and we will reach another ice age, most of the ice melting is cause the current roation is too close to the sun, but that doesn't mean we're not helping melt the icecaps ourselves.

 

[Outlawstar]

I never attacked your character. I said the conspiracy theories you believe in are crazy (which they are) and that, unlike most, you are clearly of the mindset that many conspiracy theories have some merit (which you do). Some people (myself included) are less likely to trust those who believe that the U.S. government toppled the twin towers on September 11th.

Fair enough, thats how I interpreted it though.

That's because you deliberately construct your arguments so that the overwhelming evidence that contradicts you still leaves some kind of a minuscule hole whereby it is still possible that you are correct if you just do your logical gymnastics. It's rather like how religious people rely on the fact that one cannot 100% disprove the existence of a deity as somehow making such a belief reasonable.

Luckily for me there is evidence for everything Ive ever mentioned, so it is not in any way religious thank you very much.


Well, show me them then. Show me respectable papers of record like the Times of London, or the New York Times or The Guardian or the Irish Independent drawing these obscene conclusions (that climate change is a vast conspiracy by the world's scientists) from one instance of malpractice by Australian researchers. The only links you've provided are from the Telegraph (right-wing British paper) and The Washington Times (D.C.-based American right-wing paper, well read by Republicans). It's not just a coincidence that the only ones drawing these ridiculous conclusions are the people that have always denied climate change for political convenience.

http://freakonomics.blogs.nytimes.c...-climate-science/?scp=2&sq=cru hackers&st=cse

Theres nothing ridiculous about these conclusions, whcih you would know if you actually read the documents.

No, it is one case of a small number of misbehaving scientists. The assertion that all of the proof presented in favour of climate change being the result of decades and decades of humans pumping toxins into the atmosphere is thus also doctored data resulting from a vast and sinister conspiracy by the world's environmental researchers is a blatant non-sequitor.

Misbhaving scientists? Do you even know who the scientists are, theses are the guys the UN cite in EVERY report on global warming, these are the top brass of UN and IPCC scientists.

I noticed you called climate change a fact, jeez what a genius, liek I said earlier of course climate changes, thats what it DOES!!!

You can't be serious? The climate is changing far too drastically and far too rapidly for it to be part of natural weather cycles.

No its not thats completely untrue, the climate has changed much faster in the past due to natural circumstances!

As for your scientific fact?
Id advise you actually read the emails and documents before you take the word of ANY scientist in the pay of the IPCC and the UN, you admit a conspiracy, thats all Im gonna get out fo you Im sure!!

The only conspiracy I acknowledged was the conspiracy by certain right-wing Europeans and Americans to deny climate change. And I really don't appreciate your denigrating the scientists of the world. We owe them an awful lot.

Oh man all I can say is lets just talk about the issue at hand here!