UK Anime Distributor Anime Limited Discussion Thread

[TiggsPanther]

Without the movies, it does see like a bit of a weird license pickup. Then again, if Manga's license expired and they were either unwilling or unable to renew it, it's nice that a title doesn't completely go OOP in the UK.

The Official Log Book does look intriguing. I'm not really one for artbook but an actual book with additional interview content and an event map? That's a good way of putting in something that the Manga release didn't have, and that actually adds something content=wise to the voerall package.

Here's where I think it starts to fall down, though. It's only the TV series. Sure, it's down to licensing but it would've been nice if they could wait until they could acquire the movies as well.
Then again, with Funimation also releasing a CE, they'd likely want to get something out before all the interested customers imported instead.

The fact that it seems to be basically the same discs as last time, though, that's what'll be a bit of a let-down here. Same episode split. Same authoring? So no additional on-disc content but actaully lacking the movies that people who already like the series already have.

Funimation's version seems to have everything the AL one does but includes the movies and a papercraft doggy...

Andrew will your Eden of the east sets have the original OP Falling Down?

I asked this back in May I believe. The release will use the same discs previously used by Funimation/Manga, so it'll play for the first episode only.

That's a real shame. This is something that, maybe, could've been the clincher. Definitely with the movies but quite possibly without them, too.
Especially if they'd pursued this line and Funimation hadn't.

An English-language release that actually had Falling Down as the OP in all 11 episodes would have been a unique product. It would have been something not present in the Manga release, and worth a double-dip on that score, as well as having something not present in Funimation's version.

Personally, I could gladly upgade my Manga version for one that had Falling Down every episode. The song fit the visuals in a way that the replacement OP just didn't and it actually felt like a let-down every episode. Not useful as the first feeling you get each time you pop an episode in.

Yes, the licensing costs would probably increase but here's where that gets funny for me. I'm not really one for paying over the odds to get physical extras, an outer box and lose an Amaray case. (My personal preference, as I really don't get on well with digipacks.)
However, paying extra to get the proper music from the broadcast version that otherwise wouldn't be in the home release? Hell yeah!

I don't like it when content is cut from a home video or regional release. I really don't like it when music is changed from what was originally used, especially when it perfectly fit the sequence.
So some sort of Collector Edition that had content, especially music content, restored? That would be right up my alley.

 

[HdE]

The sum of my contribution to this particular debate can be summed up as:

I like Oasis marginally less than I like Neil Sedaka.

 

[anime_andrew]

I think it's kinda scummy to take a cheap standard edition out of print and immediately replace it with an expensive and incomplete collector's edition.

It would be a shame if this were to become a regular practice. If the EotE CE doesn't sell another 1000 units, a standard edition BD may never be available in the UK again...

A) Re scummy - It never had a collector's edition in the UK before and at least in our opinion, deserved to have one. The fact it never did was sad to us so it's just a matter of perspective I guess ! The UK release contains not only everything the US set had (barring the papercraft part EDIT: and of course, the films) but it also has work that was never translated before and having read it, is really interesting if you're a fan of the show .

B) Incomplete - This is an interesting point as it's not like we ripped out two random episodes of the show here. I get where you're coming from but we've never sold this as the Ultimate for Eden of the East's universe, but the collector's version of the TV series. That said, it would seem Manga's license has lapsed so it's still conceivable to add them in with a slight delay - which if I can do - I will do. I actually cleverly already left space for them just in case too (and so if we did it later - you could buy them as standard editions and include them worst case, which would mean maximum of £20-£25 for the two). That said, I'm not going to over-promise and fail to deliver on it hence why it's not labeled as included just now .

C) Assumptions about no standard - There's a very different model to collector on new and catalog shows - so for something like Eden of the East, I think you're being extremely melodramatic suggesting it will never be available again. In fact I can safely say you're being 100% too melodramatic . Hope that puts your mind at ease!

Best,

AP

 

[HdE]

Interesting comments about the EotE films, Andrew. While it's obviously unconfirmed all 'subject to change', I'm hopeful for you guys that you can pull something like that off down the line. It'd make for an amazing package!

Semi-juicy edit: Also, for whatever it's worth, I'll be aiming to get a review of the series up on my Youtube channel close to the release date. As it's a series I think very highly of, I'm kind of keen to do whatever I can to get some positive pre-release press out there.

 

[anime_andrew]

I don't understand why AL would release a Standard Edition of the Eden of the East series. For those that want a cheaper version, you can still get it:

Amazon.co.uk: Buying Choices: Eden Of The East [Blu-ray]

To be honest, I don't even think it was a worthwhile show for them to pick up. I found it to be pretty good, but its not something I'd double dip for. Especially without the movies. The series on its own really doesn't have a satisfying end.

As for the actual UK releases of this, Manga pretty much drowned the shops with EotE to the point of it having little value. I imagine most people in the UK interested in this show have picked it up already.

This is a good point really and always happy to illuminate:

1) INITIAL INVESTMENT: Actual license cost was basically nothing on this one, it was a case of we're passionate about Kenji Kamiyama's work (009 RE:CYBORG was one of my first film licenses for starters) and the director himself is someone I respect a lot. The fact it'd never had a Collector's Edition was interesting to me .

2) SOMETHING NEW: The log book was something new we felt, after a read of the JP version, was worth releasing for people to enjoy and we'd always wanted something like a nice map of the incident. In short - we felt we could add something to the release.

3) STANDARD EDITIONS: If we go back to that, it'll be down the line for the reason you pointed out there too . It's a tough one but we want to see it out there for folks.

Re the films -this is something we agonised over and now it looks like the delay on release may have paid off. For now we can't confirm but I'd not be surprised if I were folks to see them in the end even if there's a mild delay to release to do it (couple of weeks max). Watch this space .

Best.

AP

 

[Buzz201]

A) Re scummy - It never had a collector's edition in the UK before and at least in our opinion, deserved to have one. The fact it never did was sad to us so it's just a matter of perspective I guess ! The UK release contains not only everything the US set had (barring the papercraft part EDIT: and of course, the films) but it also has work that was never translated before and having read it, is really interesting if you're a fan of the show .

This doesn't really account for the price of the show literally more than doubling over the past three months? It was £15.49 on Zavvi for Manga's "Definitive Collection" on 3rd July. They aren't selling your CE at the moment, but the cheapest price anybody (except yourselves) had was £42 from AOL. You have a limited run £30 webstore offer for a week. So people are paying £14 extra for a 40p booklet and nicer packaging (and no movies/OVAs).

C) Assumptions about no standard - There's a very different model to collector on new and catalog shows - so for something like Eden of the East, I think you're being extremely melodramatic suggesting it will never be available again. In fact I can safely say you're being 100% too melodramatic . Hope that puts your mind at ease!

Based on AL's behaviour non-UE shows have to sell out (or be expected to sell out quickly) for you to consider a standard edition release. That's a perfectly reasonable business practice to employ, but I don't think it's at all melodramatic to assume Eden of the East may not sell 1000 units.

A quick look at blu-ray.com suggests Anime Ltd. has only released BD standards for Tokyo Ghoul Root A, Terror in Resonance and Kill la Kill this year. As well as the "standard edition with pre-order bonuses" Mobile Suit Gundam, Part 2. So my general optimism with regards to their release is low anyway.

None of this really answers my primary concern (although I wasn't really clear about it in the other post), which is that AL is going to regain a bunch of licenses back from Manga's Funimation deals and then take the cheaper versions off the market. I mean, if Eden of the East succeeds, why wouldn't you do it for other titles?

 

[Jaysgba]

None of this really answers my primary concern (although I wasn't really clear about it in the other post), which is that AL is going to regain a bunch of licenses back from Manga's Funimation deals and then take the cheaper versions off the market. I mean, if Eden of the East succeeds, why wouldn't you do it for other titles?

This isn't necessarily an entirely bad thing though; there are still plenty of titles that could do with a UK release that isn't an PAL DVD.

 

[IncendiaryLemon]

This isn't necessarily an entirely bad thing though; there are still plenty of titles that could do with a UK release that isn't an PAL DVD.

True. Ouran for example is getting released on BD for the first time, and apparently Manga's DVD is a botch job anyway, so it's almost like its first proper release.

 

[Buzzkillington]

This doesn't really account for the price of the show literally more than doubling over the past three months? It was £15.49 on Zavvi for Manga's "Definitive Collection" on 3rd July. They aren't selling your CE at the moment, but the cheapest price anybody (except yourselves) had was £42 from AOL. You have a limited run £30 webstore offer for a week. So people are paying £14 extra for a 40p booklet and nicer packaging (and no movies/OVAs).

Wait, is Anime Limited responsible for that release no longer being available? Can they even do that? I just assumed it was out of print (I mean, it is an old release now).

 

[Buzz201]

Wait, is Anime Limited responsible for that release no longer being available? Can they even do that? I just assumed it was out of print (I mean, it is an old release now).

That wasn't what I meant. I meant they had chosen not to reissue a similar release.

It seems AL picked it up not longer after Manga's licence expired.

 

[Buzzkillington]

That wasn't what I meant. I meant they had chosen not to reissue a similar release.

It seems AL picked it up not longer after Manga's licence expired.

Oh right, that makes a lot more sense (My opinion of AL was about to take a nosedive had that been the case lol).

While I understand the frustration I don't think releasing both at the same time would make much sense here seeing as a standard has been available for such a long time (plus you can still buy the movies and the series separately on BD) and only recently went out of print, but then again I'm not sure this release makes much sense anyway.

If they can include the movies without increasing the price by too much I could be convinced to double dip, but it's not exactly an exciting release for me.

 

[Lutga]

I'd definitely be more likely to buy if the movies were included too. (and also, for what it's worth, I'm glad the papercraft dog isn't in there - I hate random tat like that)

I am interested to see how well the edition sells - as obviously while it's going for a completely different market than Manga's super cheap version which has been on the market for ages, as others pointed out, Eden of the East was one of those titles you'd always see whenever you looked in an HMV anime section - and my impression was it felt like one of those shows that pretty much everyone 'had'. So it just makes me wonder if beyond the hardcore fanbase who'll buy this day 1, what the lifespan of the edition will be - as if the initial print run takes a while to sell through, is there any incentive for a bare-bones basic edition down the line to replace Manga's? (although i'm sure you'll be able to pick up Manga's Blu-Rays second hand cheaply for a long time)

 

[KingJimmeh]

I don't understand your hang-up over an EotE Standard Edition. The complete box's price may have gone up, but anyone that wants to get the show can still get the series and films as individual releases pretty cheap. Its not like the price has shot up tremendously since Manga stopped printing it.

 

[Buzz201]

I don't understand your hang-up over an EotE Standard Edition. The complete box's price may have gone up, but anyone that wants to get the show can still get the series and films as individual releases pretty cheap. Its not like the price has shot up tremendously since Manga stopped printing it.

Let's get this clear, just for the record:

• Used IS NOT a replacement for new, unless it absolutely has to be (i.e. for something that went OOP a while back, say Neon Genesis Evangelion)
• Importing IS NOT a replacement for a domestic release, especially if it's Region A locked.

They're options, but do not even bother trying to pitch them as full blown replacements.

And by the way, the Definitive Edition that was £16 three months ago, is now £60 used on Amazon...

 

[Jaysgba]

I think Buzz's primary concern is that Anime Limited have still to make good on the promises of a fair few earlier standard editions that have yet to materialise. I can, therefore, understand his worry that a standard edition may not be on the cards.

EotE is just an interesting case in that there was a standard edition blu-ray years before the new Collector's Edition, and AL have "rescued" the license yet aren't replacing that standard edition version in the market.

 

[Buzz201]

I'm arguing against the principle of it. I knew this was coming, so I brought Manga's "Definitive Edition" a couple of months back (which is how I gave a specific date and price for the increase).

My problem is: What happens in the future when we don't get advance notice and those that want it can't buy it in time? With the exception of maybe Attack on Titan and the Eva Rebuilds will any reissues of former Manga titles sell enough to justify reissuing a standard edition?

 

[KingJimmeh]

I admit the price increase for the complete set is strange, but for the case of EotE, I don't believe there would be any more of a market for a standard edition of it anyways. Just because they own a license doesn't mean their obligated to keep it forever in print. Why aren't you upset at Manga for letting the license end without printing more copies for all those people who must only want the standard edition and haven't bought it at some point in the last 5 or 6 years at a really low price.

 

[Jaysgba]

I admit the price increase for the complete set is strange, but for the case of EotE, I don't believe there would be any more of a market for a standard edition of it anyways. Just because they own a license doesn't mean their obligated to keep it forever in print. Why aren't you upset at Manga for letting the license end without printing more copies for all those people who must only want the standard edition and haven't bought it at some point in the last 5 or 6 years at a really low price.

I don't think anyone actually believes Manga are letting Funimation sub-licenses lapse by choice though. And to flood the market before a license lapses and another UK distributor releases a title would be, for lack of a better term, a "dick move".

 

[HdE]

Can I just register my agreement with this:

• Used IS NOT a replacement for new, unless it absolutely has to be (i.e. for something that went OOP a while back, say Neon Genesis Evangelion)
• Importing IS NOT a replacement for a domestic release, especially if it's Region A locked.

They're options, but do not even bother trying to pitch them as full blown replacements.

And by the way, the Definitive Edition that was £16 three months ago, is now £60 used on Amazon...

There's enough in these few short lines of text to spin an entire discussion out of. I've been ppicking up used DVDs and BDs for the last few months, as it's been the only way I can afford certain things. I get ROYALLY fed up with people telling me to 'just buy second hand' when I chip in on discussions with my perspective on pricing, because:

1. Buying second hand anime doesn't directly support the industry in the way I wish I was able to.
2. The second hand market for anime is a COMPLETE JOKE.

With reference to that second point, I usually buy a small quantity of second hand stuff every year, and this year I've received a record number of inaccurately described discs. Many have needed resurfacing. Some have been unplayable. This anoys me as I usually only buy used items listed as 'used - like new' or 'used - very good'. Discs that I have to physically repair before use do not satisfy either description. And they CERTAINLY do not warrant the inflated prices I see being asked. For god's sake - some second hand listings go for twice the price of the same item brand new!

So, I fully understand the frustration here.

I don't think we're in danger of seeing standard edition releases disappear, though. If anything, as I've said before, I can see a time coming where the appetite for deluxe special edition releases wanes. There are a lot of shows that simply don't deserve the prestige that ostentatious packaging suggests. Let's be honest - a lot of anime is mediocre. And at worst... well, you can only polish a turd so much, sad to say.

When you make everything special like this, nothing feels special anymore. And that way lies consumer fatigue. I'm all for publishers creating nice packages for shows when there's a tangible demand, though. But if we ever get to a stage where it's a choice of CE or nothing... well, that'll be a sad day.

If anything, I think there's wisdom in looking at where standard editions fit in the market, and maybe re-evaluating the approach to them. Anime Limited have done really well by making sure DVD standards are out alongside CEs wherever possible. But I think there could be more acknowledgement from several different corners of the industry that there are folks who simply CANNOT afford CE prices.

Signed,
HdE
Aged 39 and three quarters
An avid non supporter of CE releases.

 

[Buzz201]

I'm not sure I like the implication from certain posts that there aren't ever going to be any new less well off anime fans...

But given I regularly feel like I'm pissing in the pool for daring to question the behaviour of certain companies and/or the absolute necessity of Collector's Editions, I think I'm probably going to have to just accept that.