The News Thread (for news that does not need a thread)

serpantino said:
as I said I wasn't accusing the op as his opinion is perfectly valid. It was more just a general question related to it. Ghibli certainly seems to be a perfect setup for anime snobbery as it's better known and more accessible than most.
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To be honest, I would personally suspect anime snobbery was mostly just pretentious uppity individuals in favour of Ghibli, opposed to everything populist. I have definitely seen one or two individuals like that on the forum, and it probably feeds into the whole fanservice debate.

Maybe it's just me, but complaining about Makoto Shinkai seems to be the "in thing" at the moment, so I see where you're coming from.
 
Buzz201 said:
To be honest, I would personally suspect anime snobbery was mostly just pretentious uppity individuals in favour of Ghibli, opposed to everything else. I have definitely seen one or two individuals like that on the forum, and it probably feeds into the whole fanservice debate.

Maybe it's just me, but complaining about Makoto Shinkai seems to be the "in thing" at the moment, so I see where you're coming from.
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I'm not sure if you're referring to me or not, but I'm just going to say on the record that Miyazaki or indeed Ghibli isn't the only anime that I 'approve' of. I like a lot of others; I just don't have the time to watch any current anime series. I'll wait another 5-10 years to find out which ones are worth watching :p I think Attack on Titan is great, as is Fullmetal Alchemist: Brotherhood...I watch films more often due to time constraints. Mamoru Oshii, Mamoru Hosoda, Masaaki Yuasa, Makoto Shinkai, Yoshiyuki Tomino, Hideaki Anno, Katsuhiro Otomo, Gisaburo Sugii, Satoshi Kon, Rintaro, Eiichi Yamamoto and Yugo Serikawa have all made what I would consider to be masterpieces.
 
Yami said:
I'm not sure if you're referring to me or not, but I'm just going to say on the record that Miyazaki or indeed Ghibli isn't the only anime that I 'approve' of. I like a lot of others; I just don't have the time to watch any current anime series. I'll wait another 5-10 years to find out which ones are worth watching :p I think Attack on Titan is great, as is Fullmetal Alchemist: Brotherhood...I watch films more often due to time constraints. Mamoru Oshii, Mamoru Hosoda, Masaaki Yuasa, Makoto Shinkai, Yoshiyuki Tomino, Hideaki Anno, Katsuhiro Otomo, Gisaburo Sugii, Satoshi Kon, Rintaro, Eiichi Yamamoto and Yugo Serikawa have all made what I would consider to be masterpieces.
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Oh no, definitely not you. Another poster made their disdain for popular anime clear, and suggested they wanted to kill themselves after watching Kizumonogatari, with only the knowledge that Belladonna of Sadness and The Red Turtle were scheduled afterwards kept them alive. (It was the tone, rather than the phrasing, that suggested to me that they never even intended to give Kizu a chance.)
 
I think the idea of "anime snobbery" is probably as much used to try and write off the opinions of others as it is used to form opinions (perhaps even more so). Some people probably do deliberately try to express dissenting opinion in order to get attention, but I think many people who seem to be doing that merely have a tendency to use strong language and exaggerated statements when talking about what they've watched. That itself could also be attention seeking but it's probably as likely to be a side effect of how strongly they hold their opinions and could also indicate a lack of understanding of the opinions of others.

In fairness, it can be difficult to understand a dramatically different opinion than yours. It's easy to assume that the opinion must be based on external factors rather than a different interpretation of the actual content. If people hold what they feel is an unpopular opinion then they might attack the staff/companies involved in producing the content because they feel that others are being distracted by those names. For those who hold what they feel is a popular opinion, they may see any disagreement as being based on deliberately disagreeing. It's very easy to fall into misunderstanding and get distracted from the topic at hand.

Regardless, I'm not sure that an "anime snob" opinion is any less valid than any other. We do all have our own bias, that's why we can only have subjective opinions rather than being able to objectively judge content. It's possible to try and set your bias aside but that won't affect your taste.

I do think it's important to try and express your opinion well, but it's also important to try and be open minded about the opinions of others. Communication is a two-way process, so sometimes it's worth the effort of trying to draw out the details of a person's opinions rather than assuming you fully understood them based on what was said.

serpantino said:
Little kids don't really care about that kind of thing though & he primarily makes kids films. It's like how star wars fans complain about major plot holes and lack of advanced lore when they've always just been kids films.
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I'm not really keen on the idea of writing something off as a "kids film" and suggesting that means it's not worth analysing. The origin and intent are aspects of the content, not the whole thing, and people should be free to approach the content from whichever perspective suits them. It's needlessly restrictive to assume that a film created for children couldn't possibly have significant depth, creative ideas or other aspects that people who aren't children might value.

In the case of Star Wars, I'd probably say they're more "family films" than "kids films" anyway. They do work on different levels and appeal to people in various different ways (which is probably a significant factor in their enduring popularity).
 
Smeelia said:
I think the idea of "anime snobbery" is probably as much used to try and write off the opinions of others as it is used to form opinions (perhaps even more so). Some people probably do deliberately try to express dissenting opinion in order to get attention, but I think many people who seem to be doing that merely have a tendency to use strong language and exaggerated statements when talking about what they've watched. That itself could also be attention seeking but it's probably as likely to be a side effect of how strongly they hold their opinions and could also indicate a lack of understanding of the opinions of others.

In fairness, it can be difficult to understand a dramatically different opinion than yours. It's easy to assume that the opinion must be based on external factors rather than a different interpretation of the actual content. If people hold what they feel is an unpopular opinion then they might attack the staff/companies involved in producing the content because they feel that others are being distracted by those names. For those who hold what they feel is a popular opinion, they may see any disagreement as being based on deliberately disagreeing. It's very easy to fall into misunderstanding and get distracted from the topic at hand.

Regardless, I'm not sure that an "anime snob" opinion is any less valid than any other. We do all have our own bias, that's why we can only have subjective opinions rather than being able to objectively judge content. It's possible to try and set your bias aside but that won't affect your taste.

I do think it's important to try and express your opinion well, but it's also important to try and be open minded about the opinions of others. Communication is a two-way process, so sometimes it's worth the effort of trying to draw out the details of a person's opinions rather than assuming you fully understood them based on what was said.
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I suspect anime's tendency to overhype and overegg everything is part of the problem.

Earlier in the year, Re:ZERO was the big show, people went on almost endlessly about how great it was (r/Anime even jokingly changed it's name to r/ReZero at one point, people were talking about it that much.) It was hyped up as the next big thing, possibly the next Steins;Gate, anime fans were going to come back to it again and again and again. Now it's gone and nobody cares that much. A few weeks in there was a "backlash" where everyone that didn't like the show came out of the woodwork and started expressing dissenting opinions. They were written off as hipsters, who only hated it because it was popular.

Indeed a few people called me that when I said I didn't like it on Discord. I wasn't hating it because it was popular, I genuinely hated the main character and his behaviour, and the show's poor handling of it's time travelling elements and internal logic did it no favours. My complaints about the show (which were not that unique) were ruled to be invalid, because most people disagreed with them. But it felt like I had to express my opinion, purely to stop the endless (and in my opinion undeserved) love in it was receiving, which to be fair says a lot more about me than it does them.

Now Yuri!!! on Ice is the big show and a similar thing is happening. It's getting a huge love in, and the people that don't like it feel like they need to constantly express their opinion to stop that. To my personal amusement, the same people that accused me of being a hipster with Re:ZERO, are now doing it with Yuri!!! on Ice.
 
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It's the way anime fandom is these days, everything is about 'newness' and being as up to the minute as possible with what's coming out. It's almost at the point now where stuff that isn't out yet is more hyped than what's actually running right now. Attack on Titan season 2 is already on more people's MAL lists as 'plan to watch' than half of the shows this season are on people's 'watching' lists, and it's not even running next season!

People want to be up to date because that's where the conversation is. The anime industry is inherently built around a conveyer belt structure, where it keeps feeding you new stuff so there's never a chance of you getting bored or 'falling off the wagon'. It's like a drug, that new hit is always just a stream away - all neatly segmented up by chapter / volume / episode etc and ready for you to inject.
 
Lutga said:
It's the way anime fandom is these days, everything is about 'newness' and being as up to the minute as possible with what's coming out. It's almost at the point now where stuff that isn't out yet is more hyped than what's actually running right now. Attack on Titan season 2 is already on more people's MAL lists as 'plan to watch' than half of the shows this season are on people's 'watching' lists, and it's not even running next season!

People want to be up to date because that's where the conversation is. The anime industry is inherently built around a conveyer belt structure, where it keeps feeding you new stuff so there's never a chance of you getting bored or 'falling off the wagon'. It's like a drug, that new hit is always just a stream away - all neatly segmented up by chapter / volume / episode etc and ready for you to inject.
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Thankfully I'm not part of this. I'd struggle to name any anime from this season, last couple of seasons or coming next season! I've never been one to stream so I've never fell in to the "newness" and need for conversation. I just buy what gets released in the UK years after it originally aired!
 
Lutga said:
It's the way anime fandom is these days, everything is about 'newness' and being as up to the minute as possible with what's coming out. It's almost at the point now where stuff that isn't out yet is more hyped than what's actually running right now. Attack on Titan season 2 is already on more people's MAL lists as 'plan to watch' than half of the shows this season are on people's 'watching' lists, and it's not even running next season!

People want to be up to date because that's where the conversation is. The anime industry is inherently built around a conveyer belt structure, where it keeps feeding you new stuff so there's never a chance of you getting bored or 'falling off the wagon'. It's like a drug, that new hit is always just a stream away - all neatly segmented up by chapter / volume / episode etc and ready for you to inject.
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I wish I could keep up lol. I don't have a clue what anime is new or trendy. I only really pay attention to what's released on physical media over here & generally the older the better. I own steins gate but I haven't even watched it yet. Not sure if i should play the game first or vice versa. My most recent watches have been yukikaze & a lull in the sea lol
 
qaiz said:
Everyones favourite anime is ****!!!
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VLL1GRH.gif
 
Being particularly positive about new shows isn't necessarily a slight against old ones, it's just that it can be easier to have conversations about shows that are currently airing and that many people are watching at roughly the same rate. With simulcasts, you basically have a new conversation each week with whatever the new episode adds. When you're talking about older shows, people that watched the show (and some that haven't) may have a general opinion of it but they may not always be able to discuss every detail (and may be hesitant to do so if it has been some time since they watched it).

Older shows may not be talked about as much, but that doesn't necessarily mean that people care less about them. It's just easier to discuss the latest show that people have been watching rather than randomly bringing up an older show. You might mention it as something you've recently watched or something you were reminded of, and try to generate discussion that way, but it's unlikely to result in as large a discussion as something new that more people have a point of reference to.

It's true that a certain amount of "hype" can influence people when they're seeing something new, we don't always have the same opinions when we consider and discuss things later or when we re-watch them. Even so, when people stop talking about things it doesn't necessarily mean that they no longer care about them. Some people may still consider Re:Zero (or whatever) to be their favourite anime but the conversation has (at least partly) moved on and they won't have as many opportunities to discuss it. I suppose it's also likely to be frowned on to keep bringing up Non Non Biyori, I mean, your favourite anime, so some people will want to avoid that (while others might do it deliberately).

I think the idea of Re:Zero as the "new Steins;Gate" is interesting, I somewhat enjoyed Steins;Gate but I didn't rate it too highly and I don't think I'd be in a hurry to watch it again. I suppose it just goes to show that people can look for different things from their anime.
 
Buzz201 said:
Oh no, definitely not you. Another poster made their disdain for popular anime clear, and suggested they wanted to kill themselves after watching Kizumonogatari, with only the knowledge that Belladonna of Sadness and The Red Turtle were scheduled afterwards kept them alive. (It was the tone, rather than the phrasing, that suggested to me that they never even intended to give Kizu a chance.)
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If I didn't want to give Kizu a chance, why would I have paid for the full animation day ticket for both me and my brother and not just...you know, purchase tickets for just The Red Turtle and Belladonna , I wonder. Maybe I just didn't like the film all that much. In fact, I even said as much in my post over in the NeoGAF thread:

(11-08-2016, 10:54 PM):
NeoGAF
(11-08-2016, 11:09 PM):
NeoGAF
(11-08-2016, 11:41 PM):
NeoGAF
 
qaiz said:
If I didn't want to give Kizu a chance, why would I have paid for the full animation day ticket for both me and my brother and not just...you know, purchase tickets for just The Red Turtle and Belladonna , I wonder. Maybe I just didn't like the film all that much. In fact, I even said as much in my post over in the NeoGAF thread:

(11-08-2016, 10:54 PM):
NeoGAF
(11-08-2016, 11:09 PM):
NeoGAF
(11-08-2016, 11:41 PM):
NeoGAF
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Your tone on here very heavily implied you went in expecting to hate the film. In fact, the tone of all your posts on here is quite clear that you simply aren't interested in giving populist anime a chance. Unsurprisingly that hatred was confirmed. If you genuinely believe you gave it a fair chance, then more power to you, but personally, I'd be surprised if you actually did.

And I don't follow NeoGAF, and I have no desire to. The only other forums I frequent are those on Blu-ray.com, and even then I avoid the anime section, because many of the posters in that sub-section suck.
 
I sometimes (many times) speak in hyperbolic terms. As I wrote in my NeoGAF posts above, the forum in which my posts are more indicative of my actual feelings, the forum where I post more seriously in regards to certain subjects, I make it clear that I went into Kizu with zero expectations, or at least as much as possible. Of course the -Gatari series being the series that it is and having the (I assume misaligned) perception that it has on people whom may not have actually seen the series, partly to blame for fans of the series themselves for focusing on aspects of the series I assume the director to be actually mocking and commenting on (toothbrush scene etc.) and also to blame for people judging the book by its cover, I won't deny that I went in with a slant, expecting it be a certain way, expecting certain tropes and such but as someone whom has never seen the series before, that is to be expected. I did not however expect it to be terrible, and in reality it wasn't that bad, I didn't like it, I found it convoluted and way too wordy (which is funny because I met another poster from GAF there who told me that the series is more wordy!) but as I made clear in my GAF post, I found it to be a positive experience, because as someone who loves animation and film, variety is indeed the spice of life. So yes you may find it hard to believe but I did not in fact want to literally jump off of the balcony by the end. My comment was in fact alluding to the notion that if I had just gone to watch Kizu by itself I would have been disappointed, but by having The Red Turtle and Belladonna after, it made the experience a more positive one.

After each film at the festival, we were given a paper and asked to rate each film, I gave Kizu a 2 out of 5.

And yes, when I say I expect Your Name to be trash in other threads, I'm being hyperbolic because in actuality I have the feeling that I will love it., or at the very least, enjoy and appreciate it, as I did Kizu.
 
That's a real shame. I might not be the biggest fan of World Trigger, but I certainly enjoyed it week to week and I hope Ashihara's health improves. :(

Worst case I guess we're looking at another Hunter x Hunter situation...
 
Demelza said:
Worst case I guess we're looking at another Hunter x Hunter situation...
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To be honest, I think manga fans are expecting it to reach that point. Apparently people guessed this was coming when he went on a fairly long uninterrupted run of chapters recently. They're also predicting that it won't return until at least late January.

Ashihara has previously taken time off for treatment of cervical spondylosis, so at least the fans aren't being accusatory and rude, like with Togashi.

On the plus side, it gives me time to finish the anime, and catch-up with the manga where I hear interesting things are afoot. Then come to crippling realisation that I am the only person who likes the anime and it's not coming back and everyone else in the world is collectively wrong.
 
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