Anime on Demand - Good news and bad news

Hanners said:
ayase said:
In that case, why bother at all? What is it's function?
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This, to me, is the more interesting question. But to know, I'd have to have access to all the relevant data... which I don't, but I imagine Kaze do. It will succeed or it won't, but for some reason I don't imagine that will depend on either of us.
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I think there are multiple answers to that question - to gauge interest in a property with a view to a physical release in the future and to monetise a license more quickly are the two obvious answers which spring to mind over and above the obvious stuff like offering a legal alternative to piracy.
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And I think what Conan's point boils down to is that a legal alternative to piracy has to be free, otherwise it's no more of an alternative than buying the DVDs. Free-loaders gonna free-load, in other words. But my personal thoughts on that are that Kaze are probably well aware of that fact.
 
I'm very much a try before I buy person, which makes it a good thing for me that I review these things, otherwise I might never buy any anime at all.

Trying before I buy also lets me sample of as many genres as I can, rather than sticking to my own preconceptions and prejudices. A couple of years ago, if someone had plonked a series description stating 'Cute girls do cute things' I would have scoffed and walked away. But I watched Crunchyroll, and am now a happy owner of Sora no Woto on DVD, one of my favourite shows.

I'd say 9/10 of my purchases are pre-viewed (although that's skewed by my wholesale replacement of my VHS collection with DVD back 10 years ago.) But even now, I'll want to watch something before I buy it. Invariably on TV, online if I have to (usually with anime) and failing that I'll pore over every review and feedback thread about a show or a movie before buying it.

I'm a nightmare online shopper, it takes me a couple of hours to commit to clicking the purchase button.

I got Blu-rayed up this year, and I admit to getting a couple of anime blind-buys when they were cheap over summer. I recently watched Origin-Spirits of the Past for the first time. I thought it was crap. Then again, I did pick up Black Blood Brothers for £3, and that turned out to be pretty enjoyable.

Oh that's another thing, if I'm going to indulge in a blind purchase, they'd better be giving it away. I'm sure as hell not going to risk more of my hard-earned than I absolutely have to on something that I might end up binning.

For me to spend money on something that I won't physically own, I have to be buying into an experience. That comes down to cinema, although with the state of cinema today, overpriced 3D Hollywood conveyer belt of crap, it's something I rarely indulge in. If you think I'm going to pay a premium to watch something, awkwardly perched infront of a laptop screen, at a desk in a secluded corner of the house, that sure ain't going to happen.

I already pay my licence fee, I mean broadband rental every month, I'm not going to pay more on top of that.
 
ayase said:
Free-loaders gonna free-load, in other words.
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No argument on that point, but why even try to cater to people who want something for nothing unequivocally?

A well-run streaming service can offer content faster and more conveniently than fansubs if it's done properly, and that to me, coupled with the whole "supporting the industry" angle, is worth a few quid each month.

Of course, that brings up a whole new sub-set of arguments around delayed availability of streams and so on, but Crunchyroll have at least proved that it's possible to offer new anime up quickly and reliably.
 
Hanners said:
No argument on that point, but why even try to cater to people who want something for nothing unequivocally?
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Because it's their way or the highway?

I honestly think what I'm asking for is not unreasonable and the perks that subscribing offers that I described are worth the tenner each month to keep.

I'm not asking every show acquired by Kazé for AOD to be viewable for free in-perpetuity, just the shows that are airing this season such that, say I was informed that suddenly Maken-Ki suddenly became Gurren Lagann 2.0 half way though the season, I could easily start from the beginning and catch up without penalty and in a lower quality bracket than the premium product and if I wanted to watch Tiger and Bunny all the way though, I have that option if I subscribe.

Again, Honey rather than Vinegar.
 
britguy said:
Am i alone in saying that 9/10 of my anime purchases are blind buys, much like 9/10 of my gaming purchases and 9/10 of my DVD/BD film purchases are blind buys?
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It is solemnly advised that an eye test may be warranted.
 
On a tangent, Andrew, would you mind giving your IP geolocation people a kick? I was unable to access the site from my phone earlier due to being outside of the UK, when I was slap bang in the centre of London ;)

(It's working fine now. O2. The videos working instantly on the phone with no app required is ace.)

R
 
Rui said:
I was unable to access the site from my phone earlier due to being outside of the UK, when I was slap bang in the centre of London
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That is most likely to be an effect of multiculturalism in the capital.
 
Zin5ki said:
Rui said:
I was unable to access the site from my phone earlier due to being outside of the UK, when I was slap bang in the centre of London
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That is most likely to be an effect of multiculturalism in the capital.
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:lol:
Damn Zin5ki, you on fire!!! You at the top on your game right now, shun. Keeping dropping them gems on us.

I'm think I'm gonna set up a Zin5ki fan club!

I am aware a lot of people are more willing to blind buy and I don't think that's a bad thing at all. But personally I think it partially comes down to fact that I am quite a serious person when it comes to matter of money and who's getting it and with so many worthy causes to put my money towards, I feel an absolute responsibility to ensure my money doesn't go to dickheads at the very least. I also tend to find anime quite a hard one to judge, some shows that look to be crud or just plain boring can end up being brilliant to me (I would have never seen Mononoke or Totoro if they had not been shown on Channel 4) and shows that pretend to be serious, can contain elements of sexism and misogyny or whatever else to such an extent that I genuinely regret providing the creators with any form of monetary support. This feels like even more of a back handed pimp smack to my chops, when I consider the fact that have little money in the first place as well.

It is true that I buy little anime due, but the shows that I feel do deserved to be supported I will support, and I would not have been able to provide it for Redline if had not been shown as part of an anime all nighter (as it doesn't initially seem like something I would like. I don't like cars and have never liked wacky racers...but I loved Redline!) same with Eden being streamed on Youtube.

Although I do see that people like me may be in the minority, we are still a loyal minority!


Edit: What the bloody hell happened to my post! Why does feature advertisement I DO NOT ENDORSE!!!

Edit 2: All your posts do too!!!! Is this my computer!??

Edit 3: They are now gone....weird!
 
Rui said:
ConanThe3rd said:
That's nice, can we get back to talking about how AOD's going Toonami/AnimeCentral now?
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I thought we were doing that funky constructive criticism thing.

R
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It can only be constructive if it leads to an end that is mutually agreeable.

It's not as if pulling the rug out from underneath everyone and going "PAY UP" is going to help the situation. It's only going to cause AOD to go out to the sounds of everyone downloading their shows illegally.
 
It's only you refusing to compromise though, and I don't think sinking their chance of profitability for one angry guy on the internet is a good business model. Plenty of decent compromises have been suggested, and it's up to AoD to see which are workable.

For what it's worth, I never got around to buying a subscription on the old site, and I have one now.

R
 
Rui said:
It's only you refusing to compromise though, and I don't think sinking their chance of profitability for one angry guy on the internet is a good business model. Plenty of decent compromises have been suggested, and it's up to AoD to see which are workable.

For what it's worth, I never got around to buying a subscription on the old site, and I have one now.

R
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No, I've put my offer on the table and I am not budging on it. If their previous model didn't work, this new one sure as hell won't.

I also think that screwing your PR over in the vein hopes you'll get more cash from what basically amounts to a right ol' cockblocking could probably do a hell of a lot more damage to a brand than simply taking the site down if it wasn't going to be viable anyway.

There's also a lot to be asked of why the sudden shift from the partnership with ANN such that the pay wall needed to be erected. I would hate to think the service was sent out to die on some misguided idea that mobile viewing was something utterly necessary or something equality dumb.
 
No, I've put my offer on the table and I am not budging on it.
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What offer? :? Do you mean suggestion?

As I have already explained, I obviously would also like free streaming of entire series to return, but Andrew has already explained (at length) the reasons behind their decision and also seems to be working hard toward something of a solution for the situation, or at least providing some compromise. He has heard out our suggestions and now all we can do is leave it up to him while hoping for the best. I doubt reaffirming your position of non-compromise will achieve an awful lot with this.
 
ConanThe3rd said:
No, I've put my offer on the table and I am not budging on it. If their previous model didn't work, this new one sure as hell won't.
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For you, no it won't. For them, it may do - i'll guess we'll see.
 
Just Passing Through said:
The trouble with this is that withholding content that is available elsewhere through illegal means, offers the lazy person a choice of either opening their wallet, resorting to illegal means, or not watching at all...

I have to admit that until Anime on Demand started up this year, my interest in online streaming had begun to wane to less than casual levels. I certainly had stopped keeping up with Crunchroll over the previous twelve months. It was only the new and exciting about AoD that got me interested again.

But, rather than withholding of content, the threat of removing content seems to work wonders in motivating me. Since CR announced the end of their licences on Dec 31st, I've been marathoning Hyakko, Glass Maiden, and Nogizaka Haruka no Himizu.

As well as the lazy and the simply satisfied with SD that will refuse to commit to subscribing, there is also the casual viewer that only dips in and out of shows, or samples only one show a season that won't subscribe. They're the people that might just become the next anime addict, if given enough sugar. They have to be catered too as well.

Crunchyroll are heavily subsidised, and have set a precedent in offering free content that makes it difficult to match unless you're Funimation or Youtube. I wish that everyone was similarly subsidised, that the industry saw the value in making their content easily and freely accessible to counter the fansubs, and act as a loss leader for the eventual sales of the discs.

Unfortunately the real world isn't as simple.

In a climate where anime on TV is not going to happen, I see online delivery of content as the next best alternative.

But to take TV as the analogy, you have your free to air channels, supported by advertising, sponsorship, or government, you also have your premium channels supported by subscription. No TV channel allows you to view when you wish to, and no TV channel has all of its catalogue of programmes instantly accessible at the viewers discretion, free of charge. You can do that for a subsciption, or pay per view, and iPlayer offers something similar, but its content will expire after a time. While some services like 4OD do allow archive material, but little new.

Because online streaming is competing with TV, it has to offer something more. For Crucnhyroll it is that accessibility of content, but that model may not be suitable for all businesses. Anime on Demand has to make money to remain viable. As a fan that wants the community to grow and prosper, I would like as much of its content as possible to be available for free. There needs to be a compromise between these two viewpoints.
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This is an incredibly balanced and reasonable post - effectively I'm certainly looking at where things fit in just now too so this is exactly the kind of discussion and thinking that should be applauded.

Same goes to everyone else really in this thread too - your opinions really do matter and without your support and feedback personally I'd never keep moving forwards :).

Andrew
 
britguy said:
Would people be interested in a service where you would pay for an annual subscription ie the £40, watch the episodes digitally and receive a discount voucher towards the hard copies if and when the title comes out on dvd/bd?

Surely a digital streaming service should just be another avenue to get people to buy teh DVD/BD products and not an alternative.

A highly unworkable scenario I know ;)
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This isn't as unworkable as it sounds - I've had several options mulling ranging from the above scenario to a package where you get exclusive merchandise for example plus early access to the homevideo release.

All tentative but I do think it's about time we all stop taking the "It has to have a subscription element + everything should be free after a week." as the status quo and start thinking creatively :).

All ideas welcomed - anyone who likes them definitely should also chime in :).
 
I'll restate my suggestions

FTA SD Video + Adverts (with an effort to have relevant adverts?) access to the series as long as it's airing in Japan as the base product.

Archive access, HD Video and Mobile Streaming as Subscription perks.

More working with other companies for both content (which can be a perk) and advertising for the SD FTA Streams with offers (Like CR offer) for Subscribers.

Manga ent. is owned by Stars Media, you telling me that don't have stuff they want to sell to the 16-30 nerd demographic?
Hell, you're Viz for goodness sake! Shonen Jump and Kadokawa Manga adds here there and everywhere! Vouchers for Forbidden Planet and Amazon?

The name of the game is "Perk", not "Punishment".
 
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