Simulwatch - Nadia: The Secret of Blue Water [final ep - 39]

37/38 done.

Changing the OP sequence in 36 was a rather odd move, considering that it spoils the designs for the new nautilus and its crew just before their reintroduction.

On a more general note, I have mixed feelings about how the show has developed into this final arc. We're basically in full-on space opera mode now, right down to the Leiji Matsumoto laser guns, and they're playing it extremely well, but I can't help feeling that the distinct character the show was deriving from the seafaring 19th century setting has finally been all but lost. It's still top stuff, and I think the series's ability to keep reinventing itself is one of its greatest strengths, but when the ending sequence rolls around with the kids chasing their dreams in the shape of that toy plane, I keep thinking "what happened to that"?
 
Ep 37 & 38

Adam is in storage on board Noah. How very Evangelion.

Neo Atlantis want England to be the first to surrender, which makes sense. The British Empire is the most powerful military force at this point in history, so Neo Atlantis would want to use it's capitulation to send a powerful message to all the other world powers. I do agree though that it was odd to demand the white flag be put up in another nation (especially a rival power like France, which might 'forget' to place the flag on the tower just so it can watch it's main rival take a beating).

A lot of collateral damage there.

Space battle was silly. Fun to watch, but still silly. Nautilus has lasers now. Homing lasers no less (lol wut?). Oh, and the 'barriers' make no sense at all. How long before the Gundams are launched? :p

Goodbye Gratan. That must have hurt Hanson to have to sacrifice it.

A face-to-face showdown, how old school. I wonder if Jean has a good enough aim to hit the mind control devices?
 
Professor Irony said:
On a more general note, I have mixed feelings about how the show has developed into this final arc. We're basically in full-on space opera mode now, right down to the Leiji Matsumoto laser guns, and they're playing it extremely well, but I can't help feeling that the distinct character the show was deriving from the seafaring 19th century setting has finally been all but lost. It's still top stuff, and I think the series's ability to keep reinventing itself is one of its greatest strengths, but when the ending sequence rolls around with the kids chasing their dreams in the shape of that toy plane, I keep thinking "what happened to that"?
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I have to admit, I have similar feelings. Good point about the ED, it does feel a little like some of that was forgotten at the end.

Episode 39
I have to wonder what the chances of Jean actually managing to hit Nadia at all would be given the distance and his complete lack of training. It'd probably have just been embarrassing if he had tried. Of course, there was still the option to pass the gun to Electra (which could also have been embarrassing if he had missed or she dropped it).

I'm not really sure why Nemo kept swinging back and forth between wanting to kill and save Nadia. I mean, I kind of understand what the idea was supposed to be but the actual circumstances never really justified it. Killing Nadia might free her from Gargoyle's control but with Gargoyle around he'd still be on the rampage. I'd at least have killed Gargoyle first and then Nadia if necessary.

In a way, Gargoyle was right about humans. They can be incredibly destructive and dangerous, he turned out to be a prime example (plus his entire organisation would be filled with evil humans). Still, I guess the fact he was missing was that they're not all that way and don't have to be. I wonder if telling him that he was human earlier might have helped avoid some of the trouble. Probably not since he seemed to be more interested in personal power rather than genuinely believing that it was best for everyone if the Atlanteans took charge (especially since he had overthrown the actual Atlanteans in the first place).

Nadia's refusal to submit to Gargoyle was interesting, essentially she was willing to doom herself and everyone on the ship rather than hand it over to Gargoyle. It kind of makes sense, she's not technically killing anyone and letting Gargoyle have the ship would almost certainly result in a lot more death. I'd imagine it's up for some interpretation but it worked for me anyway.

I have mixed feelings about a lot of the ending. Neo being unplugged was kind of silly, him struggling to get across with the last of his life seemed decent enough and it probably doesn't help that Gargoyle casually wanders over to pull a big comedy plug out of the wall. Gargoyle himself "forgetting" about the heavily armed battleship sitting in the hull of his ship was a bit silly too. Jean's "death" was handled well but it was silly that the boarding party had ended up in that situation in the first place. I'm also not entirely sure if Nadia couldn't have just taken control of the ship, used a handy barrier/platform to imprison Gargoyle, saved everyone on the ship and then destroyed it later.

I was kind of disappointed that Nemo died in the end, having him die of his wounds would have been fine and I can understand the benefits of a "heroic sacrifice" idea but by that point it felt too late to let Nemo die. It might have been a nice opportunity for the Chief Engineer to step up and say "my family is dead, you still have one, so I'll be staying" or something. To be fair, I'm probably not the most tolerant of contrived circumstances in the name of story but it felt like there were too many better options to handle things than the one they went with.

Speaking of Nemo's family, presumably Electra's child was also Nemo's. I guess it's not uncommon in anime but didn't Nemo specifically say he thought of Electra as more of a daughter? I guess some things changed since then. I'm not going to say I had a problem with it but I can't say I understood why they felt it was necessary either (maybe just to give Electra something else to live for?).

On a related note, I guess the Sanson and Marie pairing took a different turn going forward too. I guess it's okay if they're happy but I think it's a shame to lose the non-romantic relationship the two had before (or was it always romantic?).

At the end of the day it was a decent way to end things. A lot of the core points were fine and having Nadia save Jean rather than keeping the Blue Water made sense. The presentation was often good too, the music was strong as usual. I did also like the way the end of the episode moved into the ED.

Final Thoughts
Overall, the series is pretty good. It's mostly a very enjoyable adventure, with plenty of places and ideas to explore and a solid cast of characters to go along with it. It also does a good job of having a family friendly feel at times while still dealing with tough issues and dark subjects. The filler sections were unfortunate and while the show does recover for the last few episodes it did also feel like it had wandered away from what it originally was somewhat. I can't say I disliked the ending but I do think that putting a bit more thought into some of the details and events might have helped elevate it to a higher level.

There's a good chance I'll watch the show again at some point and I'd probably recommend it too. The filler is an issue but skipping it would work and there are still quite a few very good episodes throughout the series.
 
ep39
Supposedly Nadia "Can't come back"...
So Neo is under control too... Has been made into a robot by Gargoyle...
Hmmm... Neo "wakes up"
Tries to save Nadia...
Definitely eva music when "it moved"..
Succeeds in waking her up.
Nadia wants to save Neo but he explodes. Nadia gets predictably upset.
Gargoyle attempts forcing Nadia by harming others. She wont go along with it...
Sacrificing Nemo's + Nadia's blue water to save Jean?
Gargoyle was human all along. Good twist. Sense made.
Nadia gives up something she never wanted to save Jean.
Mostly talk and little action up to now. Looks like the escape will be action packed.
Good music choice.
...Nemo staying behind to destroy red Noah...
Nadia making up for her previous lack of goodbye?
Looks like Grandis got lumbered with the kids? Best choice there?
Big explosion. Jean comes round.
I guess Nadia's home is "Earth".
Token Marie and King for some optimism.
Then some 12 years later...
King got his mane. And some mini-kings by the looks of it.
Few other happy ending stories.
Left me with a smile.

Final thoughts.
A really fun series. Enjoyed the story and it does take you along for a ride quite nicely.
Next time through though I think I'll definitely skip the filler as I get the impression after this second run through that the filler subtracts from the experience. Definitely glad I watched the filler though as it allows you to appreciate the rest of the episodes more.
 
Ep 39. Can the last episode live up to my expectations? No. But then most anime have duff final episodes.

Logic really went out of the window these last two episodes. Both Nemo and Gargoyle made a huge number of errors of judgement in that showdown.

The Emperor is like some kind of prototype Evangelion unit and was unplugged, literally. That gave me flashbacks to the sillier bits of the filler episodes. Jean's death was well done though, it was appropriately sudden and shocking. And Electra's clothes partially melt off, a last attempt at fanservice?

It's impressive that Nemo can survive six gunshots even without the Blue Water's protection. Perhaps more impressive that Gargoyle can take a direct hit from the Nautilus' main cannons and walk away with a few scorch marks.

Happily ever after (aside from Nemo of course, but I'm sure he would have been content enough). Electra has a bun in the oven, it seems Nemo's feelings towards her changed significantly after her breakdown. I felt sorry for Hanson, all that wealth and no one to to share it with. And Marie with Sanson... whaaaaaaaat? :eek:

I find it difficult to believe that Neo-Atlantis would just disappear. They had so much influence, power and money that I'm sure someone would have attempted to take control of it after Gargoyles death. Oh well, I guess it doesn't matter.


Overall.
A great adventure and plenty of fun, also the kind of series you are unlikely to see in modern anime. A great first half, then the terrible filler which I'm still glad I watched just so I had the 'complete' experience, and finally a good finale which never quite recovered to the great level the series was at earlier on. It's worth a rewatch in a few years but I will definitely skip the filler next time, I see no reason to watch that more than once.
 
Ep 39

Hard to believe it's all over now :(

It was a strong ending and I think it was done right, even if it wasn't quite all I'd hoped for in the finale - I feel it definitely was more restrained, after the heart-in-mouth action of 38.

Would applaud them for keeping me guessing though on whether or not Nemo was going to die and the little twist about Gargoyle having been human all along was pretty neat. After BanzaiJedi's comment on the Atlanteans' past being like a story of the cold war, I wonder slightly if the decision to have both Gargoyle and Nemo die at the end could be an allusion to mutually assured destruction (we've seen plenty of atomic bomb imagery) and perhaps, with the cold war being at its end by 1990, that we must sweep away all the old grudges and begin afresh.

Neo having a giant three-pin-plug was a bit silly right enough, but the image of his flesh being vaporised like that was rather haunting. I'd actually seen a screengrab of his mechanical body lying in a pool of blood without knowing where it was from, so it was quite unexpected to find that was a part of Nadia.

Much as I can understand the need to keep the crew of the Nautilus onboard the ship as well, I think I'd have liked to see more of a sweeping battle taking place in the background, while the main characters were moving towards the endgame. Gargoyle's subordinates seemed to all dissappear very quickly and, given the number of times I've felt like we were visiting a bond-villain lair, I'd have liked a bit of hand-to-hand fighting between them and the boarding party, a la Moonraker or You Only Live Twice. I can imagine that would have been expensive though, and the show's budget was probably tight enough by this point, without adding any elaborate action scenes into the mix.

That was a nice little coda at the end too - I suppose I should have gotten there via process of elimination, but I didn't twig that the girl narrating it was Marie until she actually said her name.

Smeelia said:
I have to wonder what the chances of Jean actually managing to hit Nadia at all would be given the distance and his complete lack of training. It'd probably have just been embarrassing if he had tried. Of course, there was still the option to pass the gun to Electra (which could also have been embarrassing if he had missed or she dropped it).
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I really wanted them to get Sanson's arm free and have him trick-shot Gargoyle through the broken part of his mask, but I doubt they'd get that one into a family show...

BanzaiJedi said:
I find it difficult to believe that Neo-Atlantis would just disappear. They had so much influence, power and money that I'm sure someone would have attempted to take control of it after Gargoyles death. Oh well, I guess it doesn't matter.
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Presumably this is what a Nadia Motion Picture would have explored - if such a thing existed and I am reliably informed we are better off that it does not. If you catch my drift.

Thoughts Overall

I'm sure it goes without saying that I feel, once you take the filler out of the equation, what's left here is an embarassment of riches - the show is a true classic. I am not a great fan of Evangelion and still don't particularly wish to rewatch it, but I'd happily revisit Nadia anytime, and I'm genuinely interested to see what Anno might turn his hand to next, once the Eva movie cycle finally ends. I'm also glad I bought the Animatsu box set and I still find it a minor miracle that such a thing even exists, even if it doesn't have the omake episodes, which I've heard are pretty good and easily found online. I'll probably be doing some Nadia fanart in the near future too, just to commemorate finishing the show.

Lastly, I'd like to thank you all for participating and offer everyone a pat on the back for making it this far. This has been the second longest simulwatch we've done (possibly the longest continuous one? I forget whether we took a break during Stand Alone Complex), but I think it's been by far and away the most successful in terms of consistent participation, and it's been a great pleasure to go through it all with you.

Now let's all get wasted and watch Sexy Commando.
 
Professor Irony said:
Much as I can understand the need to keep the crew of the Nautilus onboard the ship as well, I think I'd have liked to see more of a sweeping battle taking place in the background, while the main characters were moving towards the endgame. Gargoyle's subordinates seemed to all dissappear very quickly and, given the number of times I've felt like we were visiting a bond-villain lair, I'd have liked a bit of hand-to-hand fighting between them and the boarding party, a la Moonraker or You Only Live Twice. I can imagine that would have been expensive though, and the show's budget was probably tight enough by this point, without adding any elaborate action scenes into the mix.
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Ooh, it would have been fun if the final showdown had involved Gargoyle and Nemo fighting it out hand to hand and being shocked at the moves the other pulls out. Basically the low tech equivalent of what most of the battles were.

Professor Irony said:
Lastly, I'd like to thank you all for participating and offer everyone a pat on the back for making it this far. This has been the second longest simulwatch we've done (possibly the longest continuous one? I forget whether we took a break during Stand Alone Complex), but I think it's been by far and away the most successful in terms of consistent participation, and it's been a great pleasure to go through it all with you.

Now let's all get wasted and watch Sexy Commando.
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It's been fun. I'd probably try to join in for the next one if it's something I have access to. Maybe something like Monthly Girls' Nozaki-kun / Gekkan Shoujo Nozaki-kun or Shirobako would be interesting. Or something I haven't watched.
 
IncendiaryLemon said:
I'd like an Eva rewatch myself although availability would be an issue.
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Maybe when Anime Limited do an Ultimate Edition at the end of next year.

I would like to see it some time. I'm not sure I'd like it but I think I'd have to watch it if there was a UK release/stream.
 
I was quite upset that the back end of this simulwatch coincided with an interminably busy later Summer for me, but I am thrilled to see how many people stayed involved, and how much people enjoyed it. Nadia is easily one of my favorite shows of all time, so to see other people coming out of it so positively is a great feeling.

Professor Irony said:
I'll probably be doing some Nadia fanart in the near future too, just to commemorate finishing the show.
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Did this happen yet?
 
ilmaestro said:
Professor Irony said:
I'll probably be doing some Nadia fanart in the near future too, just to commemorate finishing the show.
Click to expand...
Did this happen yet?
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Not yet, sadly. I got as far as roughing out the composition, but I couldn't get a handle on how best to express a vast space. It's something I'd like to come back to, but at the moment I'm hell bent on finishing my faux-retro game art project before the end of the year.
 
Great show overall, but too ridiculously long at 39 episodes. It really should have been a 27-episode series, not a 39-one. Especially with those awful filler episodes that killed much of what I loved about the series in the first place (derailing both Nadia's character and her friendship with Jean, for instance).
 
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