ROW, ROW, FIGHT THE POWAH!!! Gurren Lagann complete simulwatch

[D1tchd1gger]

Ep 7
Powah UP!
The enemy gets bigger and so does Team Gurren, sorry Team Dai-Gurren!
Not too much more to say. I did notice the quality drop, the lines went a bit pixel-y instead of nice and smooth. And lots of foreshadowing for the events of...

Ep 8
Not too much more to say than already said. There's a couple of death flags with Kamina and Yoko and then Kamina saying I'll always be by your side to Simon. And then the mood afterwards summed up by the pouring rain.
A couple of other things:

Like I say, very cleverly done.

Only to be undone by the narrator at the start of this episode "during the battle Kamina and Simon learn of the existence of the Spiral King"

It's a fictional world.

When talking about volcanos the subs capitalises the E on Earth. I looked up Planet Earth on Google Translate and it comes up as Chikyū and then listening (very) hard that's what Yoko uses.

Ep 9
In the aftermath Simon is still traumatised, but seems to be forcing himself into playing the Kamina role by going full on attack.
He then meets a girl, but has performance problems
I seem to remember there was some suspicion about Nia, but couldn't remember when it was revealed only to happen at the end of the episode when she reveals she's the daughter of the Spiral King. Wasn't she supposed to be some form of trap sent by the Spiral King? I can't remember, but it does seem she was dumped right under Simon's nose!

chick-in-a-box

The term I have heard of is Born Sexy (or cute in this case) Yesterday. Leeloo from The Fifth Element being another one.

 

[Dai]

The term I have heard of is Born Sexy (or cute in this case) Yesterday. Leeloo from The Fifth Element being another one.

I coined chick-in-a-box because it reminded me of this infamous Saturday Night Live sketch:

Spoiler: NSFW

Born Sexy Yesterday is a broader trope where the male protagonist encounters a naive female in any situation, whether that be a mermaid washed up on the shore or an alien whose spaceship crashed. Anime almost always goes with a chick-in-a-box though, or sometimes a chick-in-a-glass-tube. The distinctions are the unsubtle womb metaphor, and that a CiaB is almost always connected to an evil organisation, usually having been manufactured by them in some way.

I couldn't help but laugh when I rewatched Outlaw Star recently and noticed that Melfina is introduced in a box in one episode, only to climb naked into a glass tube in the next episode. Why have one when you can have both?!

 

[João Gomes]

Oh good lord, people spoiling Kamina's death you bunch of inconsiderate otakus.

I'm so behind on this it isn't even funny. I thought I was gonna watch this even during vacation but I'm too tired at the end of the day. On the other hand, I get to watch a bunch of episodes all at once!

Wait for meee~~~~~~~

 

[Neil.T]

Just some rebuttal and reply from me today:

I was amongst those that didn't take an instant liking to GL when first watching.

Mine is a similar experience in a way. I'd seen (part of?) the first episode online years ago, and it was more than enough to convince me, already as a Gainax fan, that it was a show that I'd enjoy.

Episodes 8 and 9 then really raised it in my estimations, but, believe it or not, the whole thing didn't properly click with me until I watched movie #2. That was it then for me then, and GL became top-tier anime, and a game changer in terms of how I would unavoidably gauge all entertainment media from that point. It was that significant.

In fact, something that I've really been noticing during this simulwatch is that I press "play" to start an episode, only to be left rather surprised a couple of minutes after the opening titles to already be seeing the mid-episode eyecatch. Then what feels like five minutes later tops, it's the end credits. Time really does fly when you're having fun.

Only to be undone by the narrator at the start of this episode "during the battle Kamina and Simon learn of the existence of the Spiral King"

Ah, good catch. I guess what with the script for episode 6 having to change, perhaps Gainax made alterations to the script for episode 7 and/or the opening narration for episode 8. Then when episode 6 was restored to its originally intended form, it created that minor contradiction. It's not in any character dialogue at least.

When talking about volcanos the subs capitalises the E on Earth. I looked up Planet Earth on Google Translate and it comes up as Chikyū and then listening (very) hard that's what Yoko uses.

I don't think it's unusual to have a fictional world in anime still referred to by chikyū, though. After all, the kanji used to write it are the ones for "ground" and "ball", so it's a pretty loose term. Gainax's film The Wings of Honneamise depicts a world very much like our own Earth but which isn't, but I can't remember if it's ever referred to as Earth in the subs/dub or as chikyū in the Japanese dialogue. Can anyone else reading this shed any light?

Also, out of curiosity, D1tchd1gger, do you still hold the volcano-dotted landscape we've witnessed so far to be Japan?


Lastly, I just wanted to end with what was a stand-out quote for me from episode 9:

"They seek out the light, even though only death awaits them. It is enough to make me despair at the nature of these creatures called humans."

I love how this show digs right to the heart of human nature. Like I say, game-changing.

 

[D1tchd1gger]

Also, out of curiosity, D1tchd1gger, do you still hold the volcano-dotted landscape we've witnessed so far to be Japan?

Like I said before it would be an obvious choice as writers tend to write what they know.
Same with ep 6. If it was written by a Western writer the Onsen Gunman would be something else. I'm not sure what though, a mall?
Actually Yoko and Leron reacted as if they knew what an Onsen was. Now they're probably long gone, but maybe there was some literature in the Litner village weapon cache? Just watching it back and right after Yoko reacts excitedly and Leron starts to explain there's a shot of a false impression of what an Onsen is with people riding a waterfall, naked people forming a ring by holding hands around a tree and a couple making out. With that classic painting of Fuji-San on the wall:

Not the best shot. Fuji-San is a bit shrouded. Here's an example of what I mean from a certain other Gainax show:

 

[Neil.T]

@D1tchd1gger:

That was a politician's answer if ever I've read one!

And I would add this to my earlier comments on the series' setting:

maybe there was some literature in the Litner village weapon cache?

I would understand this line of reasoning in a show like Gainax's series Nadia: The Secret of Blue Water, which a large part of is about an ancient civilization and what they've left behind, but GL is all about moving forwards. The script's really not that interested in using the available time to look back at history; that would be the very antithesis of its central theme and would bog down the pace, so it keeps that stuff to a bare minimum.

 

[HWR]

Episode 9
The aftermath of Kamina’s death weighs heavily on Simon, but now he has someone new to focus on in Nia. I’ll also echo just how drained he looked early on in the episode, you can feel how the devastation and loss has completely defeated him.

 

[Geriatric hedgehog]

I'd forgotten the opening credits change from episode 9 to not feature Kamina, though the end credits remain the same.

No life behind poor Simon's eyes but just rage when he's taking on the gunmen, and at times his own friends. Also interesting how Yoko admits that loss of friends in war is inevitable and one has to accept, but that she just couldn't concede this loss with that same logic and acceptance.

Gurren Lagann raging and stalking up a hill on all fours at one point was very reminiscent of Eva unit 01 going berserk and stalking Zeruel.

The heaven's opened when Kamina died and carried on right up until CiaB (love that by the way heheh) Nia arrived and very interesting contrasts have already been mentioned between those two characters. Poor Simon though, those he grows to love and is closest to he always loses...

 

[D1tchd1gger]

That was a politician's answer if ever I've read one!

You want a yes? Then yes! Of course your knowledge is greater than mine (I've watched it once nearly 4 years ago), so you might really know different.

The script's really not that interested in using the available time to look back at history; that would be the very antithesis of its central theme and would bog down the pace, so it keeps that stuff to a bare minimum.

And all I'm doing is using those breadcrumbs to have a little fun!

I mean it's not like it's the most profound thing we've done a simulwatch on. The plot is your basic Shounen plot: innocent goody-two-shoes gets some sort of power bestowed upon them and through various experiences becomes stronger beats a load of sub-bosses before becoming strong enough to face the final boss. It's been done plenty before and since.
Of course those experiences (like Kamina's death) that change the hero are worth discussing, but if there's a little mystery to think about I'm going to wonder out loud.

 

[Rui]

One thing I was listening out for was how Simon (my real name) was pronounced. Now Japanese doesn't have the Si sound so they use シ (shi) and indeed it sounds like Shimon, but I'll forgive that, but in the dub also pronounced it the Japanese way but more like SHImon (actually just watched a clip, can't change tracks on the fly on this disc, and it's more like SEAmon which is even weirder than I remember.

When you thinking about all the liberties various dubs have taken by changing Japanese things into Western things, jelly doughnuts anyone, why use the Japanese pronunciation of a Western name? (it's actually from Hebrew)

Sorry about the sudden necromancy but I was reading through the thread (I don't have time to simulcast but I am loving the secondhand blast from the past!) and I wanted to point out that Simon in TTGL isn't actually called 'Simon' (as in the English name). The anglicised name 'Simon' would be rendered サイモン (Saimon) and pronounced 100% correctly in Japan. It's common enough amongst celebrities to be well known as a foreign name, and the Simon from Durarara!! uses this pronunciation. TTGL's シモン (Simon) has a deliberately unusual name. It just happens to look exactly like our 'Simon' when rendered in romaji, which is confusing.

The English Si and Shi sounds are always treated identically in Japanese so at some point, someone in the show's production decided that the official spelling was 'Simon' (Nipponsiki romanisation) rather than the 'Shimon' that most traditionally-taught westerners would have favoured. Had it been romanised as 'Shimon' (Hepburn romanisation) or even 'Ximon' (for a more exotic twist) or something from the start it would have been less confusing, but the dub is actually being more accurate in this case by treating it as a heteronym rather than transposing it onto the more common western name.

R

 

[Lordhippos]

Episode 10.

The hardest thing for me in this episode is just seeing how broken everyone is still even though Kamina died two episodes back. They aren't given any time at all to grieve, events keep on ticking despite their desire to take the necessary time to sort things out.

People are trying their hardest to keep spirits up and fight on, but the true leadership role is definitely missing. Simon is too broken to take charge, Yoko has always taken the support role, and Kittan is just a mock-version of Kamina without the same level of charisma or respect.

Viral displaying his loyalty and his love for being on the receiving end of BDSM!

Can I take a second to say that I like Nia's hair? It's almost like it's clouds as it swirls about. One of the more unique hair styles shown in anime.

 

[D1tchd1gger]

OK, interesting, but you lost me here

heteronym

A word that has a different pronunciation and meaning from another word but the same spelling.

No matter how you pronunce a name it has the same meaning, surely. Simon apparently means "to listen" or "the listener", I've also heard "snub nose" and "obedient", none really apply to me

Anyway you cut it the English dub just sounds weird although apparently SEA-MOAN is closed to the French/Danish pronunciation:

Meaning, origin and history of the name Simon (1)

The meaning, origin and history of the given name Simon (1)

www.behindthename.com

 

[Rui]

OK, interesting, but you lost me here

A word that has a different pronunciation and meaning from another word but the same spelling.

No matter how you pronunce a name it has the same meaning, surely. Simon apparently means "to listen" or "the listener", I've also heard "snub nose" and "obedient", none really apply to me

Anyway you cut it the English dub just sounds weird although apparently SEA-MOAN is closed to the French/Danish pronunciation:

Meaning, origin and history of the name Simon (1)

The meaning, origin and history of the given name Simon (1)

www.behindthename.com

It's not the same name, though. Simon (シモン) doesn't mean any of those things because it's not a Japanese pronunciation of the Hebrew name שִׁמְעוֹן at all; the Japanese version of שִׁמְעוֹן is Saimon (サイモン). The name 'Saimon', in Japan, has the meanings you describe.

The 'Simon' in TTGL has no relationship whatsoever to the Hebrew language (as far as I know). It may as well be a Japanese name with no specified meaning. If you think of the anime character as being called 'Shimon' instead, everything makes more sense (with the caveat that in Japanese, the phoneme 'si/shi' can sound like the first syllables of both 'sheet' and 'seat' and similarly the 'mo's in 'mop' and 'moped' are represented by the same phoneme). Thus 'Seamoan' is a valid way to pronounce the Japanese name 'Simon', but not a valid way to pronounce the English name 'Simon' (no relation in pronunciation or meaning).

(Sorry for the derailments!)

R

 

[D1tchd1gger]

Right gotcha.
Still sounds weird though, why not use Shimon like any other Japanese name when doing a dub. Although I'm guessing it's an older dub and they didn't take as much care as they seem to nowadays with that sort of thing.

 

[Ian Wolf]

Episode 10

Enjoyed Nia in this episode especially, with her expression "pissing-off person". Forgot that this episode was has some quality issues in the AL version, with one moment having poorer visual quality.

 

[HWR]

Episode 10
Nia doesn’t mince her words, despite having a point but not considering the emotional weight of the situation. Simon sadly still seems to be in the same rut also. “Pissing-off person” is quite the memorable phrase too.

 

[Neil.T]

Forgot that this episode was has some quality issues in the AL version, with one moment having poorer visual quality.

Yeah, I feel like disc authorors(?) Madman missed a trick, though, because the HD footage for that part exists completely intact in movie #1. They clearly had the rights to those, too, so surely it just never occurred to them to scavenge it from there. It's definitely a missed opportunity if that's the case.

Sorry for the derailments!

I wish you wouldn't be, Rui, because I've wanted some kind of clarification on that for quite some time now.

Ever since hearing Simon's name pronounced Shimon in the original Japanese audio (confirming, as you say, that it's not the common name "Simon"), I put that together with the spelling and have been pronouncing his name like "Seemon" in conversation about the series, perhaps as if it were French. I've never actually heard any of the English dub (as usual, despite it being on the discs,), so I wasn't aware that that was using "Sheemon".

I was concerned for a bit there that I was gonna have to rewire my brain and start pronouncing it that way, but I reckon I can probably just stick with what I've already been using.

On the topic of pronunciation, can any dub watchers tell me how the name of the titular robot is pronounced in the dub? Perhaps partly due to Gurren Lagann being a little bit of an older series, the title of this show has a rather unusual romanisation. Nowadays it would just be written as "Guren Ragan" or "Guren Lagan", but it seems as though an attempt was made to steer anime fans towards the Japanese pronunciation with its deliberate choice of spelling of the title. Most likely it seems as if there was a concern that Americans would arrive at "GOOren LAYgan" (and Brits perhaps "GYOOren LAYgan") unless a more unorthodox spelling was used.

I'm not convinced that it's been entirely successful, though, because I'm sure I've heard people saying it like "Gurren LaGAHN". Perhaps "Gurenn Laagan" might have been a better shot if that were genuinely the intent?

Indeed, how do y'all watching this say the title if you're ever using it in conversation? Since suddenly switching to Japanese pronunciation mid-sentence would be as pretentious as it would be clumsy, and wishing to respect the romanised spelling, I've been going with "GÜren LAHgan" if you imagine the Ü as being like "oo" but a short, clipped sound.

And just for fun...

similarly the 'mo's in 'mop' and 'moped' are represented by the same phoneme

It obviously wouldn't affect the sound you were focussing on, Rui, but I wasn't sure whether you intended the underlined word as the past tense of "mope" or as the type of motorised scooter.

Actually, Rui, when was the last time you saw GL, if you don't mind me asking? It's interesting to know different viewers' experiences with the show.

Spoiler: to Rui

And, of course, I still remember you quoting Kamina's words of encouragement towards Simon in a response to one of my more soul-baring posts some years ago, before I'd even seen the series, so Gurren Lagann will always have that additional bit of significance to me now.

 

[João Gomes]

Yaaaasss.

Back in the game, son! Long post incoming tl:dr; is that I've marathoned 6, 7, 8, 9, 10 and 11 for good mesure, because 11 is just too incredible to not watch right after 10. Thank you, have a good evening

For all the perviness of episode 6, it had a few really cool character moments like Simon getting a reality check from Yoko but also some much deserved validation for being a dependable friend. Another was Yoko basically confessing to Kamina and of course, Kamina's thirst played for comedy was hilarious.

You can tell they had fun animating this episode but it feels like the team themselves kinda acknowledge this ended up being half an episode in terms of progress by placing Viral right there at the end so no time is lost on setup in episode 7.

Whew, the animation on this puppy

I love that you can tell Viral enjoys his encounters with Kamina and Veget-ahem, Kittan saving the day when Yoko and the others were getting attacked was fiery, 120% pure HYPE.

This one sees Simon taking the reins once again while single-handedly schooling one of the four generals in the perils of controlled explosions and once again Kamina blindly trusting him even against their strongest enemy yet. I love that Simon isn't just some helpless kid despite his adoration for Kamina and I love Kamina for sticking to his "never back out" philosophy despite everyone advising against it. A true leader

Episode 8, the turning point. What to say. The sky says it all from the beginning, in case the title and preview at the end of the previous episode weren't clear enough.

Everyone says their goodbyes to Kamina. Yoko about to ask Simon to protect Kamina but refraining from doing so because it would be unfair to pile even more pressure on top of him was a great look into her.

Speaking of Yoko, she and Kamina have their moment, which has been a long time coming, much to Simon's distress. I've been there, it's an awful feeling that eats you on the inside. Oh boy, it's nothing in the grand scheme of things but you know it really hurt him just before such an important operation.

And then, Kamina. He goes out the only way it would make sense for his character: by using the last of his fighting spirit to boost everyone's morale, to reassure Simon and to spectacularly destroy the big bad. **** me, what a ******* great character. The final minutes still cause that ridiculous single tear phenomenon in me. The ED with Simon walking alone past Kamina's figure hits you hard after all that's happened.

Anyway, episode 9. My favorite moment was Nia showing Simon it's fine being himself, after how conflicted he was about being afraid and wanting to run but that being the opposite of what Kamina would do. Love Nia and her "who the hell do you think I am?!" equivalent at the end of the episode, she's adorable! Also Yoko swallowing her pain in order to support the team is another great bit of insight into her. Great character.

And back on schedule with episode 10! "aniki-san" is just bag-of-puppies-tier adorable, my my. Yoko finally lashes out at a seemingly tactless Nia and Adiane's transformed mecha literally talks out of its as.s. Nia's determination and Simon leading the charge without the Lagann even while grieving were

Well then, what a uselessly big post. Entirely self-indulgent, but I end up having fun writing these, so that's reward enough. Let's all talk 11 tomorrow!

 

[Rui]

Actually, Rui, when was the last time you saw GL, if you don't mind me asking? It's interesting to know different viewers' experiences with the show.

Spoiler: to Rui

And, of course, I still remember you quoting Kamina's words of encouragement towards Simon in a response to one of my more soul-bearing posts some years ago, before I'd even seen the series, so Gurren Lagann will always have that additional bit of significance to me now.

Ages and ages ago in 2008 when the sub-only R1 DVDs first came out! I've bought it several times since (including the AL release) but finding time for a rewatch has proved difficult. Fortunately, it's such a zany, colourful show that it's pretty easy to remember all of the characters and twists in the plot.

Spoiler

I'm happy that my nerdy advice was memorable - as wild as the show is it has some pretty hard-hitting moments too, so stealing a quote like that felt appropriate. Kamina had some genuinely good advice for the world.

(I suspect that the quirky title spelling came from a desire for good SEO more than pronunciation; it's easy to search for stuff about the series unlike with titles such as 'B' and 'K' and '86' (gah at the lot of them). I think the JP word that became romanised as 'Lagann' ('spiral', here) is already similar in pronunciation with the unrelated (or is it...?) existing English word 'lagan' that I usually hear the title pronounced very close to the JP when it's spoken in English, accents notwithstanding. No idea how the dub does it, though.)

R

 

[Dai]

Episode 10
The highlight for me is Nia fearlessly skewering Adiane's hypocrisy. Her weapons-grade naivety makes me wince sometimes though.