"Is the Ocean Burning?" Simulwatch II: Real Drive.

[Professor Irony]

This episode felt like we're starting to move into end game territory here...

Episode 21 - Eternity/Infinity

Yeah, it definitely feels like the end is in sight now.

I'm reasonably confident the show isn't going down the same route as Planetes. Even during the roundtable discussion, I felt the higher-ups sincerely believed their plan to release the weather particles was in the island's best interest. In true tragic war-story fashion, I don't think it's going to be a battle between good and evil, as much as a battle between good and another good. Nice that they touched on the power station failure back at the start too.

The bizarre love triangle between Souta, Holon and Takanami does trouble me a little though. I suppose the implication now is that, because the team have consistently treated Holon as a human being, she has begun to think like one and has spontaneously developed feelings for Souta instead of having them added to her programming (was this also the first time she called him "sama" instead of "san"?) What worries me is how they might handle this, in light of Holon's earlier comments.

What really put me off Chobits was the abrupt about-face that series pulled from warning against the dangers of humans developing feelings for robots to suddenly championing it as some kind of ideal romance. I'm really hoping this show can deal with such a relationship on a more sophisticated level than that. Still, I am again hopeful, as they do seem to be portraying Takanami more sympathetically than I originally thought - she's obviously hurt by Souta rejecting her and genuinely does seem to see him as more than a disposable fling.

Either way, it's nothing if not interesting. Once RD is over, I'll definitely need to go back and finish Time of EVE.

Alas, nothing really suggested itself to me for a screencap in this ep - there was another Minamo-face, but it didn't really seem appropriate, given the circumstances

 

[Professor Irony]

Ep22 - "Quiet Ocean (immortal)"

Well, looks like my guess was way off. En is our end-boss after all.

I'll write a bit more tomorrow.

 

[MercenaryRaiden]

Episode 22 - Quiet Ocean/Immortal

An interesting episode that I don't have a lot to really discuss. Most of it was spelled out and there were a lot of interesting little tidbits and facts.

Lets start with the end. I think it was quite obvious something was going to happen to Holon. This is a shame but it kinda feels like a route they've been wanting to go down for a while. A three month memory wipe isn't an ideal solution, and i get the feeling that they're trying to shoe horn in a bit of drama for the last few episodes, but it tiptoes around the love between a human and android arguement.

Also who wants to bet that Kushima will go to his "maintinence" android body?

Still, it is nice to know that the Secretary General wasn't behind it. But our antagonist is Mr Jenny En!

 

[ilmaestro]

D:

I was pulled away from any sort of schedule I had over the (extended) weekend, will be caught up before the last ep though I hope!

 

[Professor Irony]

I think it's just down to the three of us now, so we could probably push things up a day, if that would help any?

Episode 22 - Quiet Ocean/Immortal

An interesting episode that I don't have a lot to really discuss. Most of it was spelled out and there were a lot of interesting little tidbits and facts.

Yeah, there's probably not a huge amount to say about this one really. The plot is fairly self-explanatory (cliff hanger again!). I'm glad the Secretary General isn't the end boss too - I didn't fancy having the evil human version of her stacked against her noble android counterpart. It would have seemed to obvious somehow. Although I'm puzzled as to how that diving-suit we saw in the previous episode is going to fit in (and if it's not part of the plot, I'll eat a VR helmet). I was surprised to see that Kushima does have a 'normal', GitS-style brain case though. Having seen him in maintenance mode, I kind of assumed there was only a small chip implanted in the neck.

Again, I'm struggling to pick screencaps now. Everything memorable just seems so spoiler-y...

 

[MercenaryRaiden]

I think it's just down to the three of us now, so we could probably push things up a day, if that would help any?

I'd be happy to do this if needed. It would give me an evening to dedicate to Catherine!

Again, I'm struggling to pick screencaps now. Everything memorable just seems so spoiler-y...

I think as we've moved into more serious territory there's a lack of silly Minamo faces and infact a bit of a lack of Minamo in general! Which makes me wonder what her role will be in the last few episodes...

 

[Professor Irony]

Cool. I think 26 would have been sunday, but I'm quite happy to make it monday instead, so we'll just go with that. I think I'm going to miss this show once it's done. I struggle to think of other things like it.

Ep23 - "Human Rhythm (individual)"

Takanami's first name is Patricia! Her role in the series is really starting to remind me of the Prime Minister in SAC: 2nd Gig; she seems like an essentially good person who's ideals are increasingly hindered by the self-serving bureaucracy around her. The image (apparently) of her and Holon linking hands on the title card makes me hazard a guess at her implanting some of her own memories into Holon to make her care for Souta again, but I rather hope I'm wrong. Surely they wouldn't give something like that away at this stage anyway...

The contrast between previous Holon and the rebooted Holon is certainly stark. Her speech seems totally lifeless now and her clothing is back in line with the other generic AI ladies. Even so, her leaving Haru is rather sad – it's like their little family's been ripped apart.

Kushima's apparent dismantling of his own mind is kind of a downer too, but having him secretly hiding in his maintenance body doesn't seem out of the question either.

There is something I probably could have screen-capped in this one, but frankly, I didn't feel comfortable screen-capping that...

 

[MercenaryRaiden]

Cool. I think 26 would have been sunday, but I'm quite happy to make it monday instead, so we'll just go with that.

Yeah i'd be cool with that. Although I've got to not play Catherine till 1:30 every night or i'm gonna fall behind!


Episode 23 - Human Rhythm/Individual
Another really good solid episode that explains a lot, including what happend with the power station at the start of the series, and having a really great ammount of character development for the Secretary General Patricia.

I agree with everything you said about the episode and don't really have a lot to add. I'm also hoping that isn't what happens with Holon but i'm not quite sure what else will happen. Then again 3 episodes is an hour. That's a lot of time in anime and so far RD is sticking to its strengths.

I feel for Patricia a lot thanks to this episode. She wants to do the right thing but forgot herself. Then she's being dicked over by The En and loses her power. Either way I can't see her involvment ending here.

Sotas reasoning for liking the Artificial Island did make me laugh as I got confused and started thinking of a kickboxing Kushima! That...Would certainly be a sight! Although I do hope they can get his conciousness back. AI Kushima seems like a bit of a stick in the mud and isn't as fun.

Speaking of The En...I wonder how this'll be resolved. He clearly has some backing behind him...And considering the type of show RD is I'm guessing we won't have a scenario like the Gits 2nd gig ending! Although after the small tussle they had a while ago I could see Sota, and maybe a reformed Holon, fighting him.

 

[ilmaestro]

The extra day would be great, cheers.

 

[Professor Irony]

I'm guessing we won't have a scenario like the Gits 2nd gig ending!

Hah, I think En should probably avoid any lifts, just to be on the safe side.

Ep24 - "Earth's Biorhythm (inference)"

In this episode: Tron.



I stand corrected -

Spoiler

Takanami's first name is Erika, seemingly.

Again, possibly not a whole lot to discuss in this ep though.

I think it's interesting that, even at this point, En doesn't seem like the caricaturish villain he could easily have been. Aside from his attack on Kushima, his actions still seem logical - he's nasty, but he's not a nutcase.

I would agree that Minamo's role in the finale is looking far more uncertain though. Can definitely see the battleship comparison with the 8th plant too.

 

[MercenaryRaiden]

Ep24 - "Earth's Biorhythm (inference)"

Yeah i've not got much to add really! Again a good episode that explains a lot and keeps ramping up the pace. The little fighting we got was yet again fluid and nice and the particles being released at the end serve as a nice cliffhanger. Anyone else think that Kushima is inside of En or something similar after he touched him?

I really like where this series has gone and I'm enjoying how it's ending. It is going to be a shame when this is over!

 

[ilmaestro]

Episode 17 - Home/Inherit
The characters can say whatever the heck they want - I'm pretty convinced that there are far fewer "coincidences" in this series than they would like us to think. It was somewhat of a tease at this late stage of the show to introduce new characters and ultimately not give us that much about them, but I think it helped put some other characters in perspective.

Episode 18 - Tjuta Forest/Ion
Oh man, I liked this episode. A really beautiful look at the world from an angle that we had been largely denied up until this point. The setting for their "school trip" felt very convincing, almost like you could have run a whole other series of stories parallel to the main show. Need to watch the next ep now!

 

[MercenaryRaiden]

I intentionally left the last 2 episodes for today so I could double bill them. It was definately not because when I looked at the time from playing Catherine that it was 4:30am. No sir. (So satisfying when you get it right! )

Episode 25 - Last Dive/ i2 = -1

THE OCEAN IS BURNING!!!

Lots of foreshadowing from the pre-title card but Kushima was always placing his faith in Haru. It just adds another depth to their relationship.

The way this episode started felt a bit weird. It almost felt as if everyone was ignoring the fact that the particles had been released. It was kind of between the build up of the last few episodes and the light hearted nature of earlier in the series.

This episode certainly felt like quite a bit of closure though. I felt that Minamo has actually grown up a lot and had come to terms with moving on from Haru. I actually really enjoyed that aspect of this episode and felt a little moved. And in the same way it started to close out Haru's part in the story. However the last episode should be good and will hopefully wrap things up nicely.

I'll get the last ep watched and my thoughts up later tonight.

 

[Professor Irony]

almost like you could have run a whole other series of stories parallel to the main show.

Y'know, that kind of crossed my mind as well. Even the weaker episodes of the series seem to have an interesting idea underlying the plot. It probably wouldn't make financial sense, but rather than a 26 episode season, I think it might have been interesting if they could have gone with 13 main episodes and a parallel series of (possibly net-based) 10 minute shorts. It would let the main story flow, but also give the writers a good outlet for world-building and exploring new concepts.

Episode 25 - Last Dive/ i2 = -1

The way this episode started felt a bit weird. It almost felt as if everyone was ignoring the fact that the particles had been released. It was kind of between the build up of the last few episodes and the light hearted nature of earlier in the series.

Yeah, I'd definitely agree on the opening part. It felt rather anti-climactic after the end of the previous episode. Very sporting of En to just let Souta go back to his regular job, but I guess it supports my notion that he's a reasonable man.

I don't quite know what to make of Minamo's cookery adventure though. She gets a lot of screentime here, but the sudden lack of drama threw me completely. The sudden change from fisticuffs to 'teenage protagonist grows up' actually reminds me of Evangelion, albeit with Real Drive giving us a much more likeable character.

I like the little scene at the end with Haru diving into the darkness though, that was rather poetic.

I've watched 26 as well.

IT WAS EARTH ALL ALONG!

(Kidding, but kinda true...)

Sadly, I'll have to leave the proper write up until tomorrow. One thing I would say though - some really nice music in that ep.

 

[MercenaryRaiden]

Mmm that would have been good, maybe even had some of them as dvd/bluray only specials, but financially it would have been bad. I'd like to have seen how well this sold. Something in my mind says it wouldn't have sold too well although i'm not sure why.

Anyways non spoilery final thoughts to come at the end:



Episode 26 - Real Drive/ i

So what Minamo, her grandmother and the guide could hear was the earths biorhythm resonating with the water molecules in their bodies. I guess we should have expected something like that!

I thought we were in for an epic fistbump. I got quite sad when Kushima pulled his hand away and started to disolve (similar to how he did in the op...Maybe we should have seen THAT coming!) and so Haru did get his old body back and we all had a happy end! Again, not a lot to add to the episode really. I was also somewhat suprised we didn't get another live action moment!

And so we come to an end. In the end i'm really glad you chose this as the show to watch. It was something I was vaguely interested in but would never have made the time for it had it not been for this thread. I'm not sure what I was expecting, especially as the show seemed to jump about at the start whilst it found its feet, but I'm satisfied and really enjoyed it.

One of the main things is that the characters were really enjoyable; quirks and all. There wasn't anyone I hated through, with even certain characters billed up as bad guys being not that big of an arse and actually being sensible. The background of the show was also something that came out really interestingly and pleasant to find out.

Overall I'm really glad that I participated in this. I was able to get back into enjoying anime on a regular basis, even with work and real life distractions. It's been a fun ride discussing each episode with everyone and I would be more than happy to participate in another simulwatch

 

[ilmaestro]

Aaaaand... I made it! Just about - it's still Monday for me and my night-on schedule. ^^;

Episode 26 - I thought they earned every inch of the somewhat fantastical elements of the conclusion to the main narrative, thematically everything came together very convincingly. I'll even let them off with the potentially cliche closing scene.

Overall, I absolutely love this show, and it's mainly down to the strength of the character relationships (Minamo/Haru, Souta/Holon, Haru/Kushima), and the individual characters themselves (specifically Minamo).

For a two cour series, the pace is very well judged, content and theme working in harmony, with deceptively little flab even during the ostensibly "filler" episodes.

Despite that, due to the tone of the series and the nature of the content, I'm not exactly shocked that this is one of (probably the) least well known and widely experienced of Shirow's works. I very much suspect a lot of his porn is more famous. ^^;

I'll come back with some thoughts on individual eps I missed at some stage (have just marathoned like six of them), but for now I will just say thank you to the Prof for getting this going, and for the great work on screencaps and the like, thank you to MR for coming back to anime (overly sentimental admission - it makes me happy to see other people happy), and thank you to all the other people who have chimed in! I would also love to come back for another one.

 

[Professor Irony]

Episode 26 - Real Drive/ i

I was also somewhat suprised we didn't get another live action moment!

That hadn't occurred to me, but now that you mention it, that might have been quite a nice way to end the series.

Also, I really meant to put this up for ep 25 - it amused me that, even so far into the series, they could still find the time to be silly:



But anyway, that ending...

I liked that they went back to the 2001 well again; I think for the writers to be referencing something like that shows the strength of their aspirations. It also seems quite appropriate, given Haru's 'rebirth' at the very end. Somehow, I'd expected not to like that idea if the show ended on it, but it worked better than I thought it might.

To some extent, it also surprised me as I thought it would be Haru who would become one with the sea, rather than Kushima. But again - strangely, it works.

Souta x Holon didn't quite ring true for me in the end, mostly due to Holon's memory wipe. For her to (I guess?) have it suddenly restored at the end felt a little cheap to me - I'd have preferred some sort of 'even if restarted, her mind will lead her here' type repentence at least. Also, I honestly felt sorry for Erika - "I like the robot you more than the real you" is kind of cold when she, like most everyone else in the series, is portrayed as sympathetic and redeemable.

On a more general note, I'd like to thank you both for sticking with the thread until the end and to everyone else who contributed as we went along. I enjoyed going through the show in this fashion as well and I think it definitely encouraged me to stick with it. I might have been tempted to shelve it (or worse) otherwise and I think I'd have missed out on a clever and original little series.

While I think a bit of a break is in order, I'd definitely be up for another simulwatch sometime soon and I certainly would not be adverse to something along similar lines. Denno Coil has caught my attention lately and sounds like it might be going for that speculative sci-fi vibe, so I might try suggesting that.

Also:

I very much suspect a lot of his porn is more famous.

Box quote found, I think

 

[Vashdaman]

Oh man I fell off with this one!

I would still love to do another one though, and don't worry next time I'll be sure to be on point.

 

[MercenaryRaiden]

I would still love to do another one though, and don't worry next time I'll be sure to be on point.

I think if another one were to happen it should probably be something that's out in the UK market so that people can access it a lot easier than say fansubs. There's definately a rich back catalog of shows to call up on and I even had some ideas floating around in mind (although I'm sure that's because I just want an excuse to rewatch a few things )

Denno Coil has caught my attention lately and sounds like it might be going for that speculative sci-fi vibe, so I might try suggesting that.

...but then again a suggestion like this comes up. Something else I'd love to revisit as I didn't give it the time of day when it first began (I did finish it but it took me around 8 episodes to start really appreciating it. Something else I'd love to rewatch...)

Souta x Holon didn't quite ring true for me in the end, mostly due to Holon's memory wipe.

I know what you mean. It felt kind of rushed just to give Sota his happy ending. I don't mind it but there wasn't much acknowledgement that Holon was back to her normal self. This is probably the one example of something in RD that perhaps needed a little more time.

I will just say thank you to the Prof for getting this going, and for the great work on screencaps and the like, thank you to MR for coming back to anime

I'd like to thank you both for sticking with the thread until the end and to everyone else who contributed as we went along.

That's no problem. As I said it's been great fun and a really nice experience. It's been a long time since I've sat down and shared my views on something I enjoy with other people. Even though I've been registered for a few years this thread has certainly made me feel like being part of the community

 

[ilmaestro]

Souta and Holon, I thought the implication was that Holon had been sort of "set free" by the events at the end of the series, allowing her to make that emotional jump a lot more quickly the second time around (having taken large chunks of the series to move not very far at all). I thought they were essentially saying this:

I'd have preferred some sort of 'even if restarted, her mind will lead her here' type repentence at least.

But squeezing it into the time they had left so that you weren't left in much doubt.

Plus, come on, Souta has had the physical and mental **** kicked out of him for pretty much the duration of the show, he's got to catch a break some time!