4 new possible UK Anime liceneses appearing on HMV?

Paradox295 said:
I was talking about the movies
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I know Ocean didnt dub all the movies, they just dubbed the first 3.

Paradox295 said:
But even with the criticism, they still sold quite well.
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Because they were cheap, had the Japanese sub and Funimation emphasised the so called high definition aspect of them.


Paradox295 said:
....what?
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It was a discussion point some years ago that Funimation tried to block the release of the Ocean dub because they feared many US fans would import it. It was not confirmed though.

Paradox295 said:
...so, the FUNimation dub could afford a whole new background track for the entire series, but it's still cheaper than a dub with recycled Megaman sound effects :?
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Ocean dub had a whole new background music track, so some themes were in megaman, who cares? A lot of people, myself included, didnt even know some themes were from megaman until they were told because they hadnt seen megaman before. Plus, the music fits much better than the cheap rock/techno rubbish that Funi put it. Also Ocean had lots of new themes in the Buu saga, plus they had quite a lot of additional sfx which helped make the dub better.

No.. it was because they decided to use their own resources because they had a deal with Cartoon Network US, so they had to use their own cast.
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The deal with cartoon network was to provide them with episodes. CN didnt ask Funi to replace the cast. The reason given was that Funi couldnt afford the Ocean Group after Saban left them.


Probably because the fans were used to the old voices and didn't like the sudden change. And... are you seriously telling me that the "Big Green" dub of the movies were BETTER than FUNimations?
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Many fans in the US didnt like the change from Ocean to Funi cast, but did Funi care?

Also, Toonami could have kept the Funi Fusion and went ahead with Ocean Kid Buu, but the fact of the matter is that Toonami bought the SAME episodes twice, first the Funi dub, then the Ocean dub. The funi dub lasted 2-3 weeks, then it was permanently pulled off air and replaced by Ocean. That was around 22 episodes if i remember. Add on the cost of Ocean hiring VAs and post production staff to dub the episodes, plus their mark up, then add the cost of AB Groupe buying, distributing the episodes plus their mark up, then finally Toonami purchasing the episodes to broadcast. Its not cheap. A broadcaster has never bought the same dub episodes from 2 competing dubs which were both ongoing. Toonami must've lost a LOT of viewers and ratings to take the step of repurchasing the same episodes but a different dub. DBZ was their top show and occupied prime time slots for most, if not all of the 5 years or so it was airing. The ad revenue lost and the money wasted on the Funi dub alone must've been convincing enough to buy the same episodes again. The Fusion saga in Ocean dub was repeated for 2 years all the way until DBZ stopped showing.

The conclusion logically follows the analysis, that alone if proof enough that the Ocean dub is WAY more popular than the Funi dub. (Not to mention why Ocean was brought back in the first place from the Android saga, fan outrage against Funimation)

And where did I say the "Big Green" dub movies were better than Funimation?

Where did you get those statistics :?
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I use an equally important factor; dub reception. The things I mentioned above happened, and they happened because most people prefer Ocean to funimation. Otherwise we would've been stuck with Funi's poorly dubbed fusion saga.

It's not available in the UK. If Manga/MVM/Beez were to release DBZ, then they should definitely go for the recent Dragon Box releases, the original Japanese and FUNimation + Japanese soundtrack
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That would be a mistake and it would be a deja vu of what happened with the movies, because it simply would not sell, thereby frightening even more companies away from thinking about releasing DBZ in the UK.

Let me explain it using the product life cycle.

The funi dub is at the maturity/decline stage, because its been released for a number of years and anyone who cares for it has probably bought it. To release a product when it is in its maturity and even more so, a decline stage, is asking to make a loss.

Funimation use product development to keep selling more of their dub, ie an existing dub with changes made to it to convince people to buy the dvds again.

Ocean's dub on the other hand would be at the introduction/growth stage (potential to sell well), a main reason being that the later Ocean dub (Android-Kid Buu) has NEVER been released on DVD before, plus it hasnt aired for years, so the many people who enjoyed the Ocean dub would snap up the dvds thereby making DBZ a good seller.

Any company that wants to sell DBZ series needs to get the dub right, and from my analysis the dub that has the potential of selling the most by far is the Ocean dub. If the dvds sell, it will hopefully be a step towards more merchandise of DBZ in the UK and easier access to the manga and additional comics etc. We cant risk a repeat of selling the wrong dub thereby making poor sales. The Funi dub just wouldnt sell if what happened in the past is an indicator, and it would be grossly unfair to the Ocean dub fans if the UK release was Funimation, because the Ocean fans have no access to their preferred dub, whereas if anyone is a funi fan, they can easily buy the funi dvds.



I don't see why you hate FUNimation so much. They dub most anime released, and DBZ is what got them started.
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I dont hate Funimation. I have seen here how poor sales of the movies have resulted in companies viewing DBZ with hesitation, simply because the wrong dub was released. I dont want that to happen with the episodes.

Also, AB Groupe probably wouldnt allow the Funi dub to be released.

Its sad that a less popular Anime like Naruto gets UK episode releases while DBZ hasnt, as of yet.
 
liamoflegends said:
I'm sure these licences will cost a bomb if they're at HMV...
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?

Not quite sure what you mean by that. HMV on-line consistently have some of the lowest pre-order prices, and it's not as though HMV are the ones licensing the shows for distribution. They'd be available elsewhere if they were licensed.
 
Maxon said:
I see you like to write essays, NightSaiyan. However a good essay writer knows that they should cite their sources.
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I tried to cut down on the points I made.

Sources would've been available...5-7 years ago. You dont believe that CNX aired the Funi fusion saga for around 3 weeks before pulling it and permanently replacing it with Ocean? I can give you the dates as a source. It was September 2002, Turner created a new channel for UK they named CNX and put DBZ and other Anime shows there. The new episodes back then were the Fusion saga, and for some reason they were Funi, a few weeks later the same Fusion saga episodes were replaced by Ocean and Funi never aired again, you only needed to have watched CNX/Toonami to verify it happened. Funi lasted only a matter of weeks, Ocean lasted for years, speaks for itself really.

As for the polls, they were on the CN/Toonami site, the Cell and Buu sagas topped the polls, the result as that there was alot more reruns of Cell and Buu sagas than Frieza/Garlic Jr saga. Even the DBZ week mostly comprised of the Cell and Cell Games saga. The Imperfect Cell and Fusion-Kid Buu sagas were the last to be shown before DBZ stopped airing, yes it was the Ocean Fusion that replaced Funi back in 2002, Ocean was still good and strong in 2005. I recorded the last few episodes before DBZ stopped, that is how I know.
 
NightSaiyan said:
Maxon said:
I see you like to write essays, NightSaiyan. However a good essay writer knows that they should cite their sources.
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I tried to cut down on the points I made.

Sources would've been available...5-7 years ago. You dont believe that CNX aired the Funi fusion saga for around 3 weeks before pulling it and permanently replacing it with Ocean? I can give you the dates as a source. It was September 2002, Turner created a new channel for UK they named CNX and put DBZ and other Anime shows there. The new episodes back then were the Fusion saga, and for some reason they were Funi, a few weeks later the same Fusion saga episodes were replaced by Ocean and Funi never aired again, you only needed to have watched CNX/Toonami to verify it happened. Funi lasted only a matter of weeks, Ocean lasted for years, speaks for itself really.

As for the polls, they were on the CN/Toonami site, the Cell and Buu sagas topped the polls, the result as that there was alot more reruns of Cell and Buu sagas than Frieza/Garlic Jr saga. Even the DBZ week mostly comprised of the Cell and Cell Games saga, and Imperfect Cell and Fusion-Kid Buu sagas were the last to be shown before DBZ stopped airing, yes it was the Ocean Fusion that replaced Funi back in 2002, Ocean was still good and strong in 2005. I recorded the last few episodes before DBZ stopped, that is how I know.
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When did DBZ stop airing here then?
 
Paradox295 said:
NightSaiyan said:
Maxon said:
I see you like to write essays, NightSaiyan. However a good essay writer knows that they should cite their sources.
Click to expand...

I tried to cut down on the points I made.

Sources would've been available...5-7 years ago. You dont believe that CNX aired the Funi fusion saga for around 3 weeks before pulling it and permanently replacing it with Ocean? I can give you the dates as a source. It was September 2002, Turner created a new channel for UK they named CNX and put DBZ and other Anime shows there. The new episodes back then were the Fusion saga, and for some reason they were Funi, a few weeks later the same Fusion saga episodes were replaced by Ocean and Funi never aired again, you only needed to have watched CNX/Toonami to verify it happened. Funi lasted only a matter of weeks, Ocean lasted for years, speaks for itself really.

As for the polls, they were on the CN/Toonami site, the Cell and Buu sagas topped the polls, the result as that there was alot more reruns of Cell and Buu sagas than Frieza/Garlic Jr saga. Even the DBZ week mostly comprised of the Cell and Cell Games saga. The Imperfect Cell and Fusion-Kid Buu sagas were the last to be shown before DBZ stopped airing, yes it was the Ocean Fusion that replaced Funi back in 2002, Ocean was still good and strong in 2005. I recorded the last few episodes before DBZ stopped, that is how I know.
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When did DBZ stop airing here then?
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Here in UK, if I remember it was around end of 2005/beginning of 2006. (Though I think it was more like end of 2005)
 
I can confirm that the Fusion saga used the FUNimation dub when CNX was around. Interestingly, when the channel reverted back to Toonami, the dub was switched to Ocean's. I actually attributed this to Toonami having stricter guidelines; FUNi's broadcast version wasn't has heavily cut as Ocean's. (The first Fusion saga episode featured a man exploding; Ocean's version, unlike Toonami's broadcast, chopped it down).

This theory became somewhat less believeable when Toonami showed Dragonball nigh-on uncut (save for instances of nudity being removed). I'll never forget the red bath of blood that exploded from Piccolo's arm when he ripped it off. At five-thirty in the afternoon!
 
Uppa said:
I can confirm that the Fusion saga used the FUNimation dub when CNX was around. Interestingly, when the channel reverted back to Toonami, the dub was switched to Ocean's. I actually attributed this to Toonami having stricter guidelines; FUNi's broadcast version wasn't has heavily cut as Ocean's. (The first Fusion saga episode featured a man exploding; Ocean's version, unlike Toonami's broadcast, chopped it down).
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Hey, glad there are more people that remember the dub fiasco.


But the Fusion saga dub switched back to Ocean well before CNX reverted back to Toonami. I recorded some episodes of the Ocean Fusion with the CNX logo on it, I can upload it if anyone wishes to verify what I'm saying is true. I think CNX lasted 1 and a half years, the Funi dub was kicked out within a matter of weeks.

Dont forget, when the Kid Buu saga first aired, it was the Ocean dub, and it was on CNX. I remember the CNX logo reduced in size during the Kid Buu saga. (The Fusion dub switched back to Ocean before the Kid Buu saga was aired)

The most likely theory is that the Funi dub got a poor reception. Toonami lost viewers who were turned off by the Funi dub and the last thing they wanted was a less than expected audience for the new episodes of Kid Buu, so they got the Ocean dub back to attract the viewers back. (You dont scare off viewers from your top rated prime time show with a load of ad revenue potential and then not try to get them back) The Ocean Kid Buu saga was in all likelyhood a success because I remember they dedicated a whole weekend just for the Kid Buu saga (remember the "artistic" advert for the Kid Buu weekend marathon?)

About your theory, if i remember correctly, the last 4 or 5 episodes of the Ocean dub were more uncut and uncensored than the Funimation dub because they used AB Groupe's footage (before that the footage was shared with Funimation, hence why title cards were the same up until the last few episodes)

I think that the UK standards are more relaxed/less strict than the US standards. DBGT and DB in UK had a LOT of blood and were, as you mentioned, pretty much uncut. Also the bridge dub movies used hell freely.

This theory became somewhat less believeable when Toonami showed Dragonball nigh-on uncut (save for instances of nudity being removed). I'll never forget the red bath of blood that exploded from Piccolo's arm when he ripped it off. At five-thirty in the afternoon!
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Lol yeah, do you remember the episode Goku won the Tournament against Piccolo Jr? Piccolo Jr blasted a hole in Goku and then pounded it, I cannot forget the oozes of blood that splattered out, and it was at peak time, i think 5:30pm. I give credit to Blue Water for making both their DBGT and DB dub pretty much uncut and uncensored. Very relaxed standards, make me wonder if Ocean's dub of DBZ would've been less censored if they didnt use the same footage as Funi.

Btw which episode is it that you referred to, was it King Piccolo or Piccolo Jr? (Been years since i saw the Piccolo sagas)
 
Speaking of Dragonball and its funi/ocean dub fiasco, it probably wouldn't matter in the long-run. I assume Funi will have its eye on the non-filler Dragonball Kai, which means it will have a new dub cast.
 
NightSaiyan said:
But the Fusion saga dub switched back to Ocean well before CNX reverted back to Toonami. I recorded some episodes of the Ocean Fusion with the CNX logo on it, I can upload it if anyone wishes to verify what I'm saying is true. I think CNX lasted 1 and a half years, the Funi dub was kicked out within a matter of weeks.

The most likely theory is that the Funi dub got a poor reception. Toonami lost viewers who were turned off by the Funi dub and the last thing they wanted was a less than expected audience for the new episodes of Kid Buu, so they got the Ocean dub back to attract the viewers back. (You dont scare off viewers from your top rated prime time show with a load of ad revenue potential and then not try to get them back) The Ocean Kid Buu saga was in all likelyhood a success because I remember they dedicated a whole weekend just for the Kid Buu saga (remember the "artistic" advert for the Kid Buu weekend marathon?)

About your theory, if i remember correctly, the last 4 or 5 episodes of the Ocean dub were more uncut and uncensored than the Funimation dub because they used AB Groupe's footage (before that the footage was shared with Funimation, hence why title cards were the same up until the last few episodes)

I think that the UK standards are more relaxed/less strict than the US standards. DBGT and DB in UK had a LOT of blood and were, as you mentioned, pretty much uncut. Also the bridge dub movies used hell freely.

Lol yeah, do you remember the episode Goku won the Tournament against Piccolo Jr? Piccolo Jr blasted a hole in Goku and then pounded it, I cannot forget the oozes of blood that splattered out, and it was at peak time, i think 5:30pm. I give credit to Blue Water for making both their DBGT and DB dub pretty much uncut and uncensored. Very relaxed standards, make me wonder if Ocean's dub of DBZ would've been less censored if they didnt use the same footage as Funi.

Btw which episode is it that you referred to, was it King Piccolo or Piccolo Jr? (Been years since i saw the Piccolo sagas)
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That's true; it was still CNX by that stage. I confess that I thought it changed over to Ocean when it was beginning to fade out of its whole 'teen-adult' ethos, mind.

Regarding the Ocean dub, my theory--and this would require some observation of what happened in Canada, and what episodes they aired (and when)--is that Ocean hadn't dubbed the Fusion Saga by the time CNX aired the Fusion batch. I had the impression that when CNX/Toonami acquired the Kid Buu Saga, they actually received the Ocean Fusion episodes alongside it--and then made the transition there for repeats. I can't verify this, sadly, but some input from Canadian viewers might help yield some answers.

Interesting, though! I actually didn't know about Ocean using the AB Groupe's footage in the last 5 episodes! I think that FUNimation--at that stage--wasn't cutting all that much out of its episodes, so I still think it might have been somewhat difficult for Ocean--if it cut anything--to be more uncut, in a sense, but it's a curious shift!

And I do agree--I think we had lighter regulations (or maybe Toonami didn't actually bother to look over what it was airing on TV; Gohan's genitals were on display in Movie 3 pretty early in the day...which was an odd move).

The episode I had in mind was the Piccolo JR. saga, incidentally! I earnestly could not believe what I was watching. I loved the voice Blue Water used for Teen Goku; I thought it was very appropriate.
 
Uppa said:
That's true; it was still CNX by that stage. I confess that I thought it changed over to Ocean when it was beginning to fade out of its whole 'teen-adult' ethos, mind.
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Well, the Funi and Ocean dub are quite similar script and edit wise, if Toonami wanted to make the show more "teen-adult" the dub would have to be less censored than both of them and with scope for hell and damn in the script, or similar to what Blue Water did.

Regarding the Ocean dub, my theory--and this would require some observation of what happened in Canada, and what episodes they aired (and when)--is that Ocean hadn't dubbed the Fusion Saga by the time CNX aired the Fusion batch. I had the impression that when CNX/Toonami acquired the Kid Buu Saga, they actually received the Ocean Fusion episodes alongside it--and then made the transition there for repeats. I can't verify this, sadly, but some input from Canadian viewers might help yield some answers.
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Thats interesting, I thought Canada got the Fusion saga before us, do you know when it aired there?

I know that we got the Kid Buu saga waay before the US did. By the time the Kid Buu saga was broadcast on CN USA we were in the middle of DBGT with the Kid Buu saga finished and repeats of it coming on.

I always thought that Ocean got the AB Groupe footage for the last few episodes because Funimation were too slow to give the footage, because they hadnt finished editing and censoring it, since Ocean didnt want to be held up, they got AB Groupe to give them the last few episodes, why else would the footage be different? If you look from the episode He's Always Late onwards in Ocean dub, there's a drastic change in title cards and colours. I thought Ocean finished DBZ before Funimation did.

Interesting, though! I actually didn't know about Ocean using the AB Groupe's footage in the last 5 episodes! I think that FUNimation--at that stage--wasn't cutting all that much out of its episodes, so I still think it might have been somewhat difficult for Ocean--if it cut anything--to be more uncut, in a sense, but it's a curious shift!
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I think there were scenes in Bulma's party and the fight against Uub In the Ocean dub which were not shown in the Funi dub because I remember someone commenting on it, is there a site which has the Funi broadcast version? It would be interesting to dig it up again and see if i remember correctly, as well as seeing if the next episode previews were different (seen as presumably Ocean had to cut their own previews for the last few eps)

And I do agree--I think we had lighter regulations (or maybe Toonami didn't actually bother to look over what it was airing on TV; Gohan's genitals were on display in Movie 3 pretty early in the day...which was an odd move).
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Yeah the Bridge dub movies were very relaxed, I remember they showed some nudity and used hell freely. It makes you realise that DBZ didnt need to be as censored as it was (But to be fair, Ocean did show a fair amount of blood as well as use of the words kill and die as their dub progresed)

The episode I had in mind was the Piccolo JR. saga, incidentally! I earnestly could not believe what I was watching. I loved the voice Blue Water used for Teen Goku; I thought it was very appropriate.
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Blue Water has some really great voices, I too liked the voice for their Teen/young adult Goku, and their Kid Goku was is awesome, I really like it, better than any dub Kid Goku voice I've heard. Blue Water didnt mind showing the bloodbath in the Piccolo Jr saga. Btw did you record or have any episodes from the Piccolo Jr saga Blue Water dub?
 
Sherlcok Hound boxset

Does anyone know any info regarding the Sherlock Hound boxset,is it dual audio,dub only or sub only,i remember the region 1 release a couple of years ago were double sided discs,dub one side,sub the other.I,ll be dissapointed if it is a dub only release,Fingers crossed it will be dual audio or sub only but i will still buy it for collection purposes.
 
Yo, dudes. I'm in the US and I'm so thoroughly entertained by the "Big Green" dubs of DBZ that I was wonderin if any of you guys know where to get torrents or hard copies of any of the "Big Green" dubs of any of the DBZ movies. it'd be greatly appreciated.
 
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