Why is it we seem to ignore UK anime releases?

[GolGotha]

I tend to only buy from the UK actually.

Even though it's annoying when there's subtitle errors, delays, ugly cases etc - I feel that if we don't support the UK companies they won't take bigger risks, series wise... and well it will just go round in circles

But perhaps it would be easier if we were told how many they sold/need to sell to consider things (ie, test out on a movie, is it sells x amount of copies we'll release the series)

 

[Peachy]

I tend to only buy from the UK actually.

Even though it's annoying when there's subtitle errors, delays, ugly cases etc - I feel that if we don't support the UK companies they won't take bigger risks, series wise... and well it will just go round in circles

But perhaps it would be easier if we were told how many they sold/need to sell to consider things (ie, test out on a movie, is it sells x amount of copies we'll release the series)

100% agree with this post.

 

[ayase]

Even though it's annoying when there's subtitle errors, delays, ugly cases etc - I feel that if we don't support the UK companies they won't take bigger risks, series wise... and well it will just go round in circles

This might seem like a terrible thing to say (forgive me Andrew, Jerome and any other reps who might be reading) but sometimes I think it it might be better if the UK market collapsed. Being a separate market from both mainland Europe and North America sucks big time for UK consumers, not just where anime is concerned but for all visual media. I tend to think we'd be better off as part of the US and Canadian market due to the fact that we share a common language - The manga we buy in the shops and online are almost all US imports already. If it weren't for region locking and the BBFC (which should just die a horrifying death already) I think it would probably be the same story with DVDs.

 

[duoinchains]

Probably 60% of my anime DVD collection is UK/R2, 40% imported R1, mostly from the US (and some of those were bought from official stalls at MCM Expo).

But yes, nowadays I tend to look for the US releases first as they:

Generally get released sooner.
Generally get released!
Have more extras


Given that we share (more or less) a common language, I fail to understand why we don't just ride off the back of the larger US market. Why go to the added time and expense of a different dub, different packaging, different licence?? Why did we suffer the 18 month delay in releasing 5cm P/S over here?? Other than being PAL format, I detect NO difference between my US R1 and UK R2 releases. Bah.

High time the studios and distributors woke up to the fact that we're a global market nowadays. Why shouldn't I buy from the best (cheapest/quickest/most extras) place, wherever that is? Which also means regional restrictions on DVD and BR is totally outdated and should be abandoned.

And don't get me started on the licencing side of things... far too much good anime gets overlooked and ignored in favour of lowest-common-denominator populist rubbish, both for US release and even worse for the UK market.

And then there's the lack of promotion/advertising.

To the studios and distributors I'd say this: I like anime. Not all of it, but I want to buy the series or movies I do like. I want to reward the creators. So, do you want my money or not??
And, much as I like the physical product, I'd happily adopt a download to own method for anime if it meant I got the series I wanted.

The industry needs to get much slicker getting product to market. I prefer subs, so I'd be happy with a cheaper subs-only release if it meant I got it sooner.



And they wonder why people turn to fansubs...
:roll:

 

[Rosencrantz]

Probably 60% of my anime DVD collection is UK/R2, 40% imported R1, mostly from the US (and some of those were bought from official stalls at MCM Expo).

But yes, nowadays I tend to look for the US releases first as they:

Generally get released sooner.
Generally get released!
Have more extras


Given that we share (more or less) a common language, I fail to understand why we don't just ride off the back of the larger US market. Why go to the added time and expense of a different dub, different packaging, different licence?? Why did we suffer the 18 month delay in releasing 5cm P/S over here?? Other than being PAL format, I detect NO difference between my US R1 and UK R2 releases. Bah.

High time the studios and distributors woke up to the fact that we're a global market nowadays. Why shouldn't I buy from the best (cheapest/quickest/most extras) place, wherever that is? Which also means regional restrictions on DVD and BR is totally outdated and should be abandoned.

And don't get me started on the licencing side of things... far too much good anime gets overlooked and ignored in favour of lowest-common-denominator populist rubbish, both for US release and even worse for the UK market.

And then there's the lack of promotion/advertising.

To the studios and distributors I'd say this: I like anime. Not all of it, but I want to buy the series or movies I do like. I want to reward the creators. So, do you want my money or not??
And, much as I like the physical product, I'd happily adopt a download to own method for anime if it meant I got the series I wanted.

The industry needs to get much slicker getting product to market. I prefer subs, so I'd be happy with a cheaper subs-only release if it meant I got it sooner.



And they wonder why people turn to fansubs...
:roll:

They do do some things wrong, things arn't promoted nearly aswell as they could be here.

However, for example, i'm sure Funimation could if they wanted set themselves up to also distribute in the UK, afterall the UK companies just sub-liscence their stuff for over here. Why don't they? Probably becuase it's not worth the hassle/costs they'd have to incur coupled with the fact that they know we will happily buy the US version with no extra effort on their part.

Also you shouldn't assume they are stupid and not aware of the global market, becuase they clearly are and use it to their benefit.

 

[Spoonmage]

Up until recently I only bought R2 releases. now i'll buy R1s if a show isn't out over here. case in point: Fist of the north star.

 

[Rui]

The US/JP companies aren't interested in distributing here for the most part, which is why this silly situation exists where the foreign releases are repackaged, BBFCed and released here. With high street shops around, this is sustainable as it caters for a casual kind of buyer who won't buy it online in the first place. As those channels are dying out, though, I feel that it's making increasingly less sense to have local editions for those of us who shop online.

This might seem like a terrible thing to say (forgive me Andrew, Jerome and any other reps who might be reading) but sometimes I think it it might be better if the UK market collapsed. Being a separate market from both mainland Europe and North America sucks big time for UK consumers, not just where anime is concerned but for all visual media. I tend to think we'd be better off as part of the US and Canadian market due to the fact that we share a common language - The manga we buy in the shops and online are almost all US imports already. If it weren't for region locking and the BBFC (which should just die a horrifying death already) I think it would probably be the same story with DVDs.

I think very much along the same lines myself for any physical media these days. Although a certain demographic benefits from the UK companies, I do not as long as they keep leaning on this model of rehashing foreign releases with fewer extras and added glitches. The negativity companies such as Manga show towards importers annoys me since they don't produce products I want to buy in the first place.

The exception is for streaming and things like Kaze's UK film screenings; both of these are good for local fans and show that having local companies to speak up for us is definitely helpful, in the absence of a sensible industry which looks after us as part of the global English-speaking world. While I aired doubts previously about AoD potentially competing with Crunchyroll in a way which would be detrimental to UK fans, it seems that isn't always the case and I appreciate their existence. I feel that this side of things needs to be aggressively pursued rather than the increasingly-outdated physical model our country works with normally - we need a library of physical shows available online legally like the US is getting, and we need fewer pointless political barriers in the way of seeing legal streams (it annoys me that Funimation do this with the licenses they acquire UK streaming rights for). The bumpy transition to Blu-ray has only made this more obvious than ever (I still don't have a UK player because I still have no faith in a future for region B).

I wonder what the new alltheanime scheme is for...

R

 

[Muu_Puklip]

Most everything in the normal scheme of things has been covered, so I'm going to give you a different kind of answer.

For months I've noticed whenever the site posts the weekly UK anime DVD releases and comments are posted on it, I usually see the same things said over and over again

You might reasonably ask why people feel the need to say those things repetitively. That is, if people don't like the UK releases then why bother posting 'negative' comments more than once? Which is what I think you are hinting you really wanted to ask.

Now I admit I myself am guilty of buying US releases over UK releases but recently most of what I've bought is UK releases cause I like to try and support Manga UK when I can.

Other people have already flagged up the need to question any national, market, or brand loyalty as being potentially irrational in what is now a very large globalised market. They have given good reasons for doing so. But then, you aren't being irrational. There are good and sound reasons for your behaviour in a free market. The people who repetitively post negative comments about UK releases aren't being irrational either. Sometimes we have to look at the medium to explain the behaviour. Website and forum design often does encourage a lot of people to feel that they have to repeat themselves to make sure their point gets across and is noticed or heard.

Now I do understand some circumstances like US/UK release date gaps and possibility of faults (Panty And Stocking comes to mind) but honestly I have to ask why do we shun the UK market so much

Who is the 'we' you are referring to? The repetitive posters? Or more broadly across the fan community?

For the former, it's that website/forum design thing. They might be repetitive but it doesn't mean they will be comprehensive and clear with fully worked out reasoning in their posts. But you should have the general reasoning now from the responses to this thread.

For that latter, it's the way the globalised market is developing. Law and national structures lag behind technology and market innovation. So it's not so much about looking down on our home market and the firms within it, it is more about being rational consumers in a changing global market.

 

[Reaper gI]

Given that we share (more or less) a common language, I fail to understand why we don't just ride off the back of the larger US market. Why go to the added time and expense of a different dub, different packaging, different licence?? Why did we suffer the 18 month delay in releasing 5cm P/S over here?? Other than being PAL format, I detect NO difference between my US R1 and UK R2 releases. Bah.

As I blogged about this one, it's a lot more than 18 months( it's 18 months after the Australian PAL release, the format conversion had nothing to do with it).
Manga thought they had rights they didn't (so they could do a BD release), and were waiting to be allowed to do this as HMV don't stock re-releases in store, so they had to do BD and DVD on the same date.

The dates are as follows.

first licensed in the USA by ADV films in June 2007
announced for UK release by ADV films in August 2007
released in the USA in March 2008
released in Australia in August 2009
released in the UK by Manga Entertainment March 2011

 

[Shiroi Hane]

IIRC Manga's release got pushed back a few times. I no longer remember the actual dates and it is hard to search for (and I could well be mixing it up with the Karas BD which was in a similar boat).
It was me discussing the BD with Manga on Twitter, although again finding the actual quotes and dates would be a nightmare.

As a side note, I went to see 5cm/s in Swansea in November 2007, courtesy of ADV and introduced by Hugh David.

 

[chaos]

As I blogged about this one, it's a lot more than 18 months( it's 18 months after the Australian PAL release, the format conversion had nothing to do with it).
Manga thought they had rights they didn't (so they could do a BD release), and were waiting to be allowed to do this as HMV don't stock re-releases in store, so they had to do BD and DVD on the same date.

The dates are as follows.

first licensed in the USA by ADV films in June 2007
announced for UK release by ADV films in August 2007
released in the USA in March 2008
released in Australia in August 2009
released in the UK by Manga Entertainment March 2011

This one is a whole different bag of cats. The license belonged to ADV, which went down before they had the chance to release it here. Manga managed to clear the rights for the license only in 2011.

 

[Reaper gI]

As I blogged about this one, it's a lot more than 18 months( it's 18 months after the Australian PAL release, the format conversion had nothing to do with it).
Manga thought they had rights they didn't (so they could do a BD release), and were waiting to be allowed to do this as HMV don't stock re-releases in store, so they had to do BD and DVD on the same date.

The dates are as follows.

first licensed in the USA by ADV films in June 2007
announced for UK release by ADV films in August 2007
released in the USA in March 2008
released in Australia in August 2009
released in the UK by Manga Entertainment March 2011

This one is a whole different bag of cats. The license belonged to ADV, which went down before they had the chance to release it here. Manga managed to clear the rights for the license only in 2011.

No they gave up on doing a BD release in 2010, they've had DVD rights for much longer
http://www.animeuknews.net/news/2280/5- ... p-%C2%A318

 

[Durial666]

I only ever buy UK releases. I have no real interest in importing and running the risk of custom fees and what not. If the UK market were to collapse I would simply walk away from it all and stop buying any anime at all.

 

[Ian Wolf]

I only ever buy UK releases. I have no real interest in importing and running the risk of custom fees and what not. If the UK market were to collapse I would simply walk away from it all and stop buying any anime at all.

If custom fees are your main worry, I'd recommend buy American releases from United Publications, becasue there doesn't seem to be any such charges with them.

 

[Rosencrantz]

I only ever buy UK releases. I have no real interest in importing and running the risk of custom fees and what not. If the UK market were to collapse I would simply walk away from it all and stop buying any anime at all.

If custom fees are your main worry, I'd recommend buy American releases from United Publications, becasue there doesn't seem to be any such charges with them.

They don't charge fees becuase i'd assume they have already paid what ever was due when they as a business imported the item.

Lets have a look at a recent release

Shakugan no Shana Season 2 DVD/Blu-ray Part 1

It's $41.99 at Rightstuf, that's approx £25.80. Assuming you get hit by customs for 20% VAT and Royal Mail Ransom Money of £8, thats an extra £13.16, not sure on the postage.
Off the UK UP1 site its £36.66 plus about £3-4 Postage
Off the US UP1 site, sourced from their "UK warehouse" it's Approx £33.84, though this varies according to your credit card's charges when being billed the $54.58

Item's from UP1 are clearly more expensive for the item itself, but looking at the price for a UK UP1 copy vs a import duty US copy its basically the same price before adding in postage from the US. When you consider you can shave a few quid off ordering via the US UP1 storefront they definately win out except when the royal mail fail to pickup the customs charge (multiple items from Rightstuf in 1 parcel would also reduce the impact of the handling fee)

 

[alexrose1uk]

I'll buy from wherever gets me the 'best deal'. I have multiregion BD and DVD, which didn't cost me that much actually; although I think perhaps I got lucky with timing on grabbing my BD player!!

Now 'best deal' is a bit of a relative term; sometimes it's price, sometimes it's extras, and sometimes it's simply media availability (why would I want to buy say a split collection that costs me twice as much as a nicely done imported set; or alternatively is only available in DVD when I can get the BD from the US at a similar cost?).

Throw on top Mangas frequent bodge-ups which leaves me not too fussed to run out and order/preorder from them, example in point waiting months for the Haruhi BD as I thought I'd support the UK release, then it getting cancelled.

That's not to say I won't buy from the UK either; me and my brother have MangaUK releases; and I've frequently grabbed things from MVM's Deal of the Week, but simply put my loyalty isn't bound to a UK retailer as I have the ability to look further afield, and the UK sellers aren't always the best option, plus with the rise of online shopping, buying from abroad can be extremely easy.

I like supporting UK industry, but I have to temper this with the simple thought 'why spend more for an inferior product'?

 

[bakum4tsu]

Bump!

I'll buy uk over us nowadays even though there arent as many shows available as are in the us. And here a lot of things goes oop within 1/2 years and in the us things keep living for years and years. Still i prefer nowadays uk releases.

Ok, uk releases have ugly packages but on the other hand, are cheaper and for me that is important. Still, if a show i really would get a decent release with nice packaging and extras and son on, i would be willing to pay a bit more for it for sure.

They get released a lot later? Ok for me, i can survive myself with fansubs and i dont have problems saying that i do watch a lot of fansubs. Usually i dont go out and buy stuff i didnt see yet, unless its a movie, which the price is lower that buying a full series. The show can get released 2 years or more after it aired in Japan. Fine by me. If i like it, i'll buy it. I don't see the rush in getting things unless you just watch your dvd stuff.

Next extras. Honestly, i dont care about extras, i barely have time to watch series so i'll pass extras unless its something good.

Now quality might be the hardest part in here. I have a few r1 releases and if at the time i thought there were ok, now with bigger tv's they look like a bit crap. Anyway those r1 have at least 5 to 7 years so i can understand that. Basilisk, beck, peace maker kurogane, among others. A few days ago i've tried them in my new tv which is quite big and oh boy the imagem was crap. Anyway, people say r1 is better and i cant say nothing against cause i havent bought anything r1 lately to compare but ive always read for the last years that r1 its always better so ill believe in that. Uk releases looks ok to me nowadays. I like good quality of course like everyone else but i can survive with good quality, dont need excelent quality.

I need to say that i only still buy dvds and dont plan to buy DB for the next years unless their prices really go down and still, digital stuff will be the future for sure and no one can deny that and im not sure if im willing to invest in another physical form for now. I now it will take a while, still i dont want to.

I'll probably be attacked because of some crap i said but its the way i see things.

 

[Mangaranga]

Now quality might be the hardest part in here. I have a few r1 releases and if at the time i thought there were ok, now with bigger tv's they look like a bit crap. Anyway those r1 have at least 5 to 7 years so i can understand that. Basilisk, beck, peace maker kurogane, among others. A few days ago i've tried them in my new tv which is quite big and oh boy the imagem was crap. Anyway, people say r1 is better and i cant say nothing against cause i havent bought anything r1 lately to compare but ive always read for the last years that r1 its always better so ill believe in that. Uk releases looks ok to me nowadays. I like good quality of course like everyone else but i can survive with good quality, dont need excelent quality.

In regards to older shows, you have to take into consideration the resolution they were animated at. Most new shows are animated in at least 720p (Some companies like JC Staff/Bones still do 540p) so naturally those shows are going to look better regardless of the format. Some people don't even see the difference between DVD and BD.
R1 is better for Bluray, no doubt about it simply because there is a much wider range to pick from, in regards to DVD though, if you don't mind the PAL speedup and Manga's amazing QC'ing record there isn't really much difference between R1/R2 releases at all.

I need to say that i only still buy dvds and dont plan to buy BD for the next years unless their prices really go down and still, digital stuff will be the future for sure and no one can deny that and im not sure if im willing to invest in another physical form for now. I now it will take a while, still i dont want to.

I don't see BD prices coming down until A) More people adopt the format (Higher Sales) and B) Production costs fall further.
Digital, well some people like myself don't like Digital/Streaming. I would rather own a high quality Physical copy of something than stream a low bitrate 'HD' copy, or download a Digital copy with DRM. (For example DVD bitrate is up to 10k for video, BD is up to 40k, HD Streams are usually like 3-5k.)
I can see why digital/streaming services like Netflix would be more appealing though, but they just aren't for me.

I'll probably be attacked because of some crap i said but its the way i see things.

Why would you be attacked for presenting your personal view? We're not that horrible, honest! :twisted:

 

[bakum4tsu]

Now quality might be the hardest part in here. I have a few r1 releases and if at the time i thought there were ok, now with bigger tv's they look like a bit crap. Anyway those r1 have at least 5 to 7 years so i can understand that. Basilisk, beck, peace maker kurogane, among others. A few days ago i've tried them in my new tv which is quite big and oh boy the imagem was crap. Anyway, people say r1 is better and i cant say nothing against cause i havent bought anything r1 lately to compare but ive always read for the last years that r1 its always better so ill believe in that. Uk releases looks ok to me nowadays. I like good quality of course like everyone else but i can survive with good quality, dont need excelent quality.

In regards to older shows, you have to take into consideration the resolution they were animated at. Most new shows are animated in at least 720p (Some companies like JC Staff/Bones still do 540p) so naturally those shows are going to look better regardless of the format. Some people don't even see the difference between DVD and BD.
R1 is better for Bluray, no doubt about it simply because there is a much wider range to pick from, in regards to DVD though, if you don't mind the PAL speedup and Manga's amazing QC'ing record there isn't really much difference between R1/R2 releases at all.

Yes the older shows had a complete diferent resolution that nowadays of course and that helps getting bad quality with new tvs, still could be worse.

Well obviously that the diferences between dvd and db are quite a bit starting fromvideo resolutions and audio at least. Though, i think db its only worth for shows that were aired in 720p at least. Shows that aired in SD i dont think you could see such diference, though i think the image might be worked for sure to look better. Still i know the first sd to hd DB were upscaled, which resulted in a not great quality as expected from what i now.

I need to say that i only still buy dvds and dont plan to buy BD for the next years unless their prices really go down and still, digital stuff will be the future for sure and no one can deny that and im not sure if im willing to invest in another physical form for now. I now it will take a while, still i dont want to.

I don't see BD prices coming down until A) More people adopt the format (Higher Sales) and B) Production costs fall further.
Digital, well some people like myself don't like Digital/Streaming. I would rather own a high quality Physical copy of something than stream a low bitrate 'HD' copy, or download a Digital copy with DRM. (For example DVD bitrate is up to 10k for video, BD is up to 40k, HD Streams are usually like 3-5k.)
I can see why digital/streaming services like Netflix would be more appealing though, but they just aren't for me.

DB prices will not come down for sure but for me, i think its not worth yet to invest in it. For now, im happy with dvd. I dont mind getting a double play with db and dvd together, even better, but for now, ill just use dvds.

Regarding stream, i dont use it, i use fansubs if i need. In my country there's no official service for that, if i try funimation channel or other free and legal stream service, they all say that the service are not available in my country so it sucks. Otherwhise i might use them. Anyway... I prefer to have physical copies too, im a bit of a collector so i prefer that way and to look at my shelves and admire it and pick something to watch. Still i dont think we cant deny that in a not large numbers of years, digital we get us all and every device will be connected to each other and share same stuff, like does already these days with phones, tablets and so on, using same accounts. And lets be honest, i think its great. You can see whatever you have whenever you are. Anyway, this is another topic.

I'll probably be attacked because of some crap i said but its the way i see things.

Why would you be attacked for presenting your personal view? We're not that horrible, honest! :twisted:

You never know to who you're dealing with :lol:

 

[Rui]

While I disagree with some of your points bakum4tsu, if anyone attacks you for having them you can just send one of the team a PM and we'll come and wallop them

You make perfectly rational arguments for thinking the way you do, and that's never a bad thing. By the way, Crunchyroll streams some titles to Portugal nowadays, so you should nag them to keep supporting your country. It's ridiculous that people are locked out from the legal sources so often when the digital world should be bringing everyone together, not making it impossible for them to buy stuff.

R