Mamoru Hosoda Movie Marathon

[João Gomes]

And back in here, Wolf Children is, so far, my favorite Hosoda movie - and I just wanted to say how cool it is to have another parent in the audience, Geriatric hedgehog; that, coupled with @D1tchd1gger 's trivia about the movies makes for a really cool simulwatch, schedules be damned!

I agree 2000% with everything you wrote @Geriatric hedgehog, including thinking to myself "oh yeah, a storm to up the stakes ok" lol

I loved just about everything about this movie. I think having each kid follow their own, strict path instead of a mix of being a bit of both made for a more interesting movie, even if I think Ame needs to chill the f out with his lone wolf thing... In human years it would've been much too soon, but well, he's also a wolf I get abandoning humanity for animals in general, I know I've wanted to many times lol, but not over my own mother.

Still, the metaphor is there and sound and covered by the fact he's more than old enough as a wolf to follow his path.

Loved the CG used on the vegetation and water - reminded me of Vanillaware and their animation work. I was interested in the audio commentary but not with a ratio of 4/2 between voice actors and creators.

Already started Beast yesterday and will edit this post with pictures of the Kaze edition when I get home.

Where you at, @Neil.T?!

Edit: as promised, the Kaze set

Spoiler

A slipcase inside a slipcase. A slipcascep- sigh. Can't resist this stupid low hanging bait.

Also pictured: my daughter's toy bananas.




Bunch of key animation cuts with the respective animator's name.

Then there's a mini-novel written by Hosoda at the end of the booklet, Dinner of the Beast, which I must own but will otherwise never read because there are only 24h in a given day and being able to dedicate some time to anime is already a victory tears and such

There are also two relatively big interviews with Hosoda. Cool edition.

 

[D1tchd1gger]

Kaze edition

Nice! Meanwhile in the UK we got a bare bones release by StudioCanal with an o-ring and... nothing else not even a combi! And no extras on the disc! I had to buy a separate dvd when I sent the Hosoda films to my little sister.
I might buy the Hosoda Collection from the States at some point to go with the first 3 that Manga released, but the discs are A only IIRC. Although when StudioCanal's licence runs out FuniUK might be able to bring it out here.

Interesting vote @Neil.T and you've seen Belle at SLA, haven't you? Care to expand?

 

[João Gomes]

Nice! Meanwhile in the UK we got a bare bones release by StudioCanal with an o-ring and... nothing else not even a combi! And no extras on the disc! I had to buy a separate dvd when I sent the Hosoda films to my little sister.
I might buy the Hosoda Collection from the States at some point to go with the first 3 that Manga released, but the discs are A only IIRC. Although when StudioCanal's licence runs out FuniUK might be able to bring it out here.

Interesting vote @Neil.T and you've seen Belle at SLA, haven't you? Care to expand?

Funi make cool (albeit strictly vanilla, so far) CEs, so they should be able to come up with something worthwhile when the time comes! Not too good, I hope, otherwise I'll bite and doubledip and we don't want that, do we.

But yeah, it's cool knowing Hosoda brought his perspective on parenting to his movies starting with Wolf Children, second-hand and otherwise. Eager to watch Beast with a new perspective!

 

[Neil.T]

Where you at, @Neil.T?!

Hiya, João. How're you doing?

I'm reading along keenly with the simulwatch, but I've been enjoying a good bit of gaming in my free time lately, so I haven't actually been rewatching any of the films. I've still only seen Mirai the once, mind, so I'll see if I can join in for that one.
I totally get what you mean about there only being 24 hours in a day, and that's without having to juggle any parenting!

That's a great Kazé set for The Boy and the Beast you've got there, dude. And speaking of that film...

Interesting vote @Neil.T and you've seen Belle at SLA, haven't you? Care to expand?

Howdy likewise, dude. You spotted my vote for The Boy and the Beast, eh? Can't get anything past you there.

I have seen Belle, yeah. It was actually at a special screening at Glasgow Film Theatre outside of SLA that included an in-person Q&A with Hosoda himself.

I really enjoyed the event, but the simple explanation is that I honestly wasn't all that keen on the film. I won't say any more on that front at this stage of the simulwatch.

In the end, I gave my vote to The Boy and the Beast partly because it had no votes at that point. It and The Girl Who Leapt Through Time are probably my favourite Hosoda films, so my vote could just as easily have gone to the latter in a different set of circumstances. The Girl Who Leapt Through Time is a very special film to me, because it's the very anime that fully opened my eyes to just what the medium is capable of. I'm very fond of The Boy and the Beast as well because it has so much charm and wit in its script, and it also felt good to wholeheartedly enjoy a Hosoda film again after Wolf Children kind of missed the mark with me compared to his previous two. I actually prefer the manga adaptation of Wolf Children to the film. I'm sure that opinion goes firmly against the grain as well, though.

I'm enjoying reading everyone's thoughts, and this is a really well-run thread. Your research is adding to the experience, @D1tchd1gger .

 

[Lordhippos]

Boy and the Beast

First of all, I will say that I agree with a lot of what you said @D1tchd1gger - the film had some interesting ideas but ultimately fell a bit flat for me. I think having seen 4 of his films now I can safely say that Hosoda is not my favourite director, and I think that's OK.

The art work was great, no complaints at all on the overall quality here. The thing that I think made this film less good than some of his others is simply just how PG it was. I felt like even a child could watch this as the themes and the stakes are all very vanilla, even the Penguin Highway we did the other week would probably have been a bit risque for kids given the whole boobs obsession!

There was still bits I liked about it of course, it wasn't a terrible film, but if I had to order them at the moment I would go:

Girl who Leapt Through Time > Wolf Children > Boy and the Beast > Summer Wars

The first half and the build up was more interesting than the latter half I think, and there are several reasons for this, the most obvious one to me was the antagonist who just appeared almost out of nowhere with very little build up. The only real foreshadowing we had was his beat down of Kyuta prior to the duel with no real obvious reason given, and his extremely obvious disguise of being a human wearing a fake animal costume that apparently no one could see through.

I disliked his entire reason for running away. He had family who would take him in, he didn't even try, just zoomed out of there and ran off to fend for himself instead. His dad wanted to reconnect, nope, didn't give it a chance. I found Kyuta to actually be a bit of an asshole at times.

The human world bits with Kaede were pretty good I thought, but the ending battle with the whale thing wasn't great, talk about button mashing the same move over and over! How cliche was him turning into a sword and filling the hole in his heart as well? Most kids don't want 24/7 surveillance by their parents, now his dad is always with him, whatever he's doing!

 

[João Gomes]

Oh yeah, still on the topic of Wolf Children, one thing that was a bit of a downer was Ame wanting to protect wildlife in the region from suffering with disasters and such and ending up being indirectly responsible for Hana going through all that when looking for him.

And on to ADIDAS AND BURGER KING PRESENT: The Boy and The Beast!

Lovely movie, I just love Hosoda's characters, they're all uniformly adorable, seriously. Not the fake sweet kind neither.

I liked the relationship between Kyuta and Kumatetsu a lot and how they helped each other, their complicity. Really beautiful. The change in focus to delve into Kyuta's life and desires was also welcome in principle and something that would naturally happen but as stated already, it signaled the beginning of the loss of focus the movie goes through and it's true that after so many years, one would expect the relationship between Kyuta and Kumatetsu to be solid enough that even if he got curious, he wouldn't turn his back on the one who is essentially his dad.

Didn't think much of the final battle neither and Mamoru Miyano was barely a character, just something to overcome. The ending was, honestly, extremely unsatisfying to me. At this point and after all that transpired, him going back to the human world and living with his biological father is eeeh.

I always remember that line from guardians of the galaxy 2: "he may be your father, but he ain't your daddy". I guess I don't like what happened to Kumatetsu, in the end.

I liked it and it's got that feel-good quality all throughout, but the ending left a sour taste.

Curious about Mirai, now!

Edit: forgot to slap your answer here @Neil.T, but yeah I get you, I'm kind of leaving my anime phase for FF XIV lately - but I hope you'll have the time to chime in about Mirai! The lowest rated movie of his, if I understand correctly? Eager to see why, exactly.

 

[Lordhippos]

I was wondering if instead of the fight as the ultimatum, we saw more of a conflict on which world Kyuta wanted to stay in, if he had to pick and couldn't choose "both" which one would he opt for? Either the human world with Kaede and his real dad, and all of the knowledge he could pick up, or the beast world with his adoptive father.

 

[WMD]

The Boy and The Beast

This is the second time I've watch this. Firat time being when it first came out on blu ray and I have to say I enjoyed it a hell of lot more this time round. It's just a really uplifting tale of overcoming darkness (literally) and moving into a more hopeful and fulfilling life.

I really enoyed the narrated intro with the fire animation. Was a really cool unique way to introduce this firmly fantasy film even though the introduction is largely grounded and very melancholy. The film really sets the scene for Ren's early state of mind and hopelessness.

The first half had a lot things I really enjoyed like the use of CCTV shots while he's running away from the cops - and really liked how that came back to be a crucial bit of visual storytelling in the final act. I also really enjoyed the lads road trip to find out about inner strength. For what amounted to a montage it really showcased the different characteristics of 4 of them and showed us the journey the main 2 still had to go on.

I also liked the whole sequence of Ren learning by imitation and how it finally bore fruit when he could understand his masters movements by sound alone. It led to a really cool shift in dynamic between the two of them when they finally learnt to respect one another and both grow as people which is then visually shown with Ren growing up over years of training.

The whole call back with master reincarnating as a sword and becoming the sword in Ren's soul was great and visually great (the whole 3rd act was stunning) and fantastic emotional send off for the film. A father doing everything (and the only thing) he can for his son. To save him, to help him, to guide his path and to let him go and become a man living his own life. I definitely cried a bit. Loved it.

 

[D1tchd1gger]

Mirai
The third film made at Studio Chizuru and the second written solely by Hosoda himself. Again he went to the well of personal experience, this time thinking to himself how would his son adapt to being the older sibling after witnessing him throw a tantrum because his new sister was getting more attention. The scene where Kun hits Mirai with the train apparently actually happened!
He also used the story of his wife's great-grandfather to base the story of Kun's great-grandfather on.

To help the animators with getting the look and movement of the characters right Hosoda brought his own children to the studio for them to use as reference material.
He also brought in various people to design specific things for the film, like using a real architect (Makoto Tanijiri) to design the family home.

The setting is a place on the border between Isogo and Kanazawa districts in Yokohama. Yokohama was chosen because the it's a place that constantly changes, whereas the film "is a story about how a family can change but always remains itself".

The film opened on the 20th of July, 2018, but didn't take as much as The Boy and the Beast in its first week or during its whole run taking ¥3¼b and not making the top 10 of the year. It did however take the Best Animation Award at the Japan Academy Awards.

"I don't wanna!"
My god Kun's a right brat! I'm an older brother to a sister with roughly the same age gap, but don't remember being that bad, I'll have to ask my mum!

The present day stuff was annoying because of him, it was probably too realistic to domestic problems to be entertaining, although there was a few humorous moments. The fantastical stuff with the dog as a human and Mirai visiting from the future were fun and past sections were interesting with the mum shown to be just as brattish when she was young and the great-grandfather being cool and then later showing that the story of the race to win his futures wife was true! The getting lost in the train station part was weird and apart from the bit where he "saves" Mirai was a bit too long and felt pointless. The best part was the visit to the great-grandfather and then actually using the lesson from the vision to learn to ride his bike in the present. I think the explanation of the tree being the family tree would have worked better if we saw some sort montage of it belonging to the great-grandfather and then the neighbourhood growing and changing around it. I think it was the tree he raced to, but it isn't clear.

Whilst the design of the house was quite cool, I guess it was built before they had Kun as it seems really impractical for having kids! The art and animation were very good again with the movement of the characters being realistic, apart from the comedic moments, and the camera work was really good.

I going to knock it down from 8 to 7. Maybe watching on the big screen made it better or maybe the English actor for Kun was better at being bratty.

 

[WMD]

The present day stuff was annoying because of him, it was probably too realistic to domestic problems to be entertaining

This is basically my biggest problem with the film. It actively affects my enjoyment and engagement of the film that I pretty much don't like any of the family. Older sister and human dog being the only characters I liked and enjoyed.

 

[Geriatric hedgehog]

The Boy and the Beast

The one I didn't have in my collection so ordered it in for the watch and was then reminded of why that was the case in the first place. Never been my favourite but unusually I liked it less on this second watch and generally found it all pretty average overall.

The opening depicting some of the main characters of the story in flames was beautifully rendered, a grand visual start. The visuals and animation were generally very good and I liked the continuing trend of oscillating between scenes including the scene where the hip boyos get schooled by Kyuta off scene whilst the girls watch. Nice montages again. The interactions between the two kids, Kyuta and his adoptive daddy were great, and the love between the two despite the clashing of their similar temperaments was very clear. I found all the characters likeable and well realised but ultimately underdeveloped, as the story just got busier and busier as it progressed and tried to do too much, which this time around didn't really work for me. The finale didn't quite connect, with the "hidden" antagonist, whilst having a backstory that would've worked very well if given more time and attention, just felt thrown in.

So good animation and visuals overall, including the fight scenes, but the story was too ambitious resulting in a lack of focus. Too much to be contained within the runtime for the movie, which was very palpable this time around. To borrow a phrase I heard elsewhere recently, perhaps this was akin to an excess of ingredients smothering a dish.

The first birth happening at home on a snowy day gave me Clannad PTSD but I snapped right out of it with the river scene. Very raw, the close-up on the eye especially painful.

Ah what a good spot on that similarity, I didn't at all think of that but will struggle not to next time! And I'm totally with you there on having a great appreciation when anime focuses on adult stories and romance and the whole family unit as Clannad and Summer Wars do, which really makes them excel for old timers like moi.

Yuki's energy and sense of humour reminds me of my own daughter, it's great.

Once again I'm completely with you here dude, Yuki is as adorable as she is hilarious, such a bundle of energy and very accurately depicted as a toddler heh.

The montage of visiting different masters was interesting and could have easily been a film in its own right

It really could couldn't it? It should have been The Fellowship of the Ring to The Boy and The Beast's trilogy.

Unfortunately from there the film seems to get distracted by a new idea every 10-15 minutes.

I felt exactly the same.

One that did not was Satoko Okudera and thus is the first film solely written by Hosoda.

but it definitely could have done with a tighter script and that second pair of eyes that worked well with the previous 3 films

Yeah definitely felt that absence this time around and it's a real shame as a result. The man does too much, reminding me a bit of Shinkai though I think the latter is better at keeping the stories more focused.

and I just wanted to say how cool it is to have another parent in the audience, Geriatric hedgehog

Likewise dude, it's really nice to have another parent to together be reminded of our own critters when we watch these animated ones so lovingly and accurately portrayed.

I get abandoning humanity for animals in general, I know I've wanted to many times lol, but not over my own mother ...... Oh yeah, still on the topic of Wolf Children, one thing that was a bit of a downer was Ame wanting to protect wildlife in the region from suffering with disasters and such and ending up being indirectly responsible for Hana going through all that when looking for him.

Yeah that really didn't stick for me, especially given how he was portrayed as being so attached to his mum previously and how hard poor Hana broke her back to provide for her family. I was actually hoping and expecting the trope of him valiantly rescuing her at least, given all the trouble he put her through, not merely finding her after the fact and unceremoniously dumping her in the middle of the car park...tsk tsk Ame, that is no way to treat a mum that special. And why couldn't he do his Miyazaki protector of the wild thing, but at least come home (which seems 5 minutes away, not exactly a commute!) every so often to lonely mummy clearly-no-longer-dearest. But apart from that what a gem of a movie heh.

I can safely say that Hosoda is not my favourite director, and I think that's OK.

As much as I love Wolf Children and Summer Wars, I can't say I have the same love for his other movies so I'm of the same opinion. Of course that is not to say he isn't a great director, just not my favourite either heh.

And on to ADIDAS AND BURGER KING PRESENT: The Boy and The Beast!

To which Shinkai says "I see your Adidas & Burger King Hosoda and raise you a Pepsi, McDonald's, Apple...." and he keeps droning on as Hosoda slowly gets up and walks away. (If anyone needs a reminder: Every Blatant Products Placement in Weathering With You).

I'm kind of leaving my anime phase for FF XIV lately

Ah I've been really wanting to give that a shot but unsurprisingly am far more of a single-player story guy, especially now with life commitments. The only time I tried online gaming was Destiny when it was first released, off the back of Bungie's fantastic storytelling in Halo, but just didn't have the time to commit properly to those bloody pain-in-the-backside raids. That and nobody I know shares my gaming predilections. So with that in mind, would you recommend it being worth me giving FFXIV a shot or should I just forgeddabbouuddeeett?


Ah man, are we on Mirai already? Dammit, I need to try and watch it tonight as I'm very likely to really fall behind otherwise...

 

[Neil.T]

The Boy and The Beast
. . .
It's just a really uplifting tale of overcoming darkness (literally) and moving into a more hopeful and fulfilling life.

I've been following this thread, obviously, and it's clear that my view of The Boy and the Beast seems to be rather at odds with the general opinion of it.

I just wanted to say that after reading your post I found myself thinking "Yep, that's definitely the same film I watched."

You know, I remembered something just the other day. When The Boy and the Beast was on at my local independent cinema during its theatrical run, it had the luxury of having a small handful of screenings over the course of a week rather than just a single showing. I went to one of the early screenings of it and liked it so much that I went back to see it again the next week.

That's actually the only film I've ever done that with to date.

Edit: forgot to slap your answer here @Neil.T, but yeah I get you, I'm kind of leaving my anime phase for FF XIV lately - but I hope you'll have the time to chime in about Mirai! The lowest rated movie of his, if I understand correctly? Eager to see why, exactly.

I'm going to dig my copy of Mirai out of storage to give it a rewatch, but I think we've seen already in the thread some of the reasons why it's not as well regarded as other films in the Hosoda canon.

And for me, it's been Super Mario Maker 2 that's been occupying my time lately. It's too much fun to be able to put it down!

 

[Lordhippos]

Mirai

Man I wish Hosoda would stop rubbing it in our faces that he has kids. I get it, drawing from personal experience can be important in the creative process, but I just wish his films were more ambitious, and less about his idea of family. If I wasn't watching this film for the sake of the simulwatch I don't think I would have made it to the end.

Once again, the art is nice, but we spend far too much time dealing with domestic issues that most of us who don't have kids won't really care for. If anything this films helps reinforce why kids can be a nightmare and not having them can be a good thing (hell I'm sure that they can also be rewarding, but hard work doesn't begin to describe them).

100% agree with @D1tchd1gger that house is horrifically unfriendly towards kids, so many floors, and so many steps. I think I'd like it from an interesting architecture point of view, but for a family with practicability in mind, no chance, you'd have a 75% chance of any kid you have dying by falling down the stairs, especially to that front door. Also pretty sure Oak Trees can grow massive, those roots would certainly offer structural issues later.

My biggest issue with Hosoda films is basically outlined above and in my other movie comments, it's too PG and there are no real stakes, especially in this film, and a little bit on Boy and the Beast as well.

Ranking from me: Girl Who Leapt through Time > Wolf Children > Boy and the Beast > Mirai/Summer Wars.

I don't think Hosoda has all bad ideas, but it seems the films he's personally spear-headed alone haven't been as good.

 

[João Gomes]

To which Shinkai says "I see your Adidas & Burger King Hosoda and raise you a Pepsi, McDonald's, Apple...." and he keeps droning on as Hosoda slowly gets up and walks away. (If anyone needs a reminder: Every Blatant Products Placement in Weathering With You).

Daaaaaamn. That's extremely blatant lol Shinkai straight up bypassing production committees, financing his movies with sponsors alone. I definitely don't remember that!

I will say, I actually hm enjoy.... product placement, the first impression is, like everyone, "oh shiit, it's that real life brand" but when that disappears, it actually serves to immerse me further into what I'm watching. I feel largely unconcerned by that kind of marketing, anyway. Unless it's that insidious

I uh, should get to watching Mirai - eventually

 

[Lordhippos]

I feel largely unconcerned by that kind of marketing, anyway. Unless it's that insidious

I'm OK with it on the whole as well as long it's not too in your face. If a bit of sponsorship that is handled without being ridiculous helps finance things, then I'm for it. I would however not want too much all at once, at least it's not in everything.

On the flip side I do enjoy seeing anime with funky twists on actual places, with silly names and logos instead of the real ones.

I uh, should get to watching Mirai - eventually

Yep, definitely watch it in the mirai!

 

[João Gomes]

Yeah, detecting dollar store versions of actual brands is also an interesting pastime when watching anime, @Lordhippos!

And stop making me snort like a pig, that last line oh MY~~~~~~

 

[D1tchd1gger]

Belle is almost upon us. Not sure about the rest of the country, but there's a screening tonight in Southampton. I've got a ticket for Friday though.

Anyone else going to the cinema to see it? I think when discussing any spoilers we probably should put them under a

Spoiler: Spoiler Tag

spoiler tag

for now.

 

[WMD]

Belle is almost upon us. Not sure about the rest of the country, but there's a screening tonight in Southampton. I've got a ticket for Friday though.

Anyone else going to the cinema to see it? I think when discussing any spoilers we probably should put them under a

Spoiler: Spoiler Tag

spoiler tag

for now.

I'm going sat and yeah agree re: the spoilers.

 

[Lordhippos]

Yeah I won't watch it for a while yet, so gotta be careful of spoilers!

Ideally tag any Belle posts with Belle written in nice Bold font at the top, then I'll at least see it at a glance and I can skip reading it!

 

[Geriatric hedgehog]

I just didn't get a chance to watch Mirai but saw it not too long ago in the last year or two, so will just go on what I am reminded of from everyone's thoughts.

He also used the story of his wife's great-grandfather to base the story of Kun's great-grandfather on.

The grandfather's story was easily my favourite bit of the film, especially the race between him and his future wife. Again, I absolutely loved the subtle potency and genuine love that was portrayed here, to a much shorter but no less effective extent than the romance in the first part of Wolf Children. Sometimes just some very short excellent sections like this can really elevate a movie in my estimations and another such example I was reminded of was from Lu over the Wall and the grandfather's recollection of his mother's boating accident. I found it very emotional and very sweet, just like this one in Mirai.

The present day stuff was annoying because of him, it was probably too realistic to domestic problems to be entertaining, although there was a few humorous moments.

Very true and it gave me the impression that it was made more to sympathise with the life challenges parents of a new baby face with each other and the children, rather than to entertain the wider audience!

The getting lost in the train station part was weird and apart from the bit where he "saves" Mirai was a bit too long and felt pointless.

It did seem at odds with the tone of the movie though I did find it an effective demonstration of the fear, dread & helplessness a very young and dependent child would feel at being lost or in some other terrifying predicament.

I think the explanation of the tree being the family tree would have worked better if we saw some sort montage of it belonging to the great-grandfather and then the neighbourhood growing and changing around it. I think it was the tree he raced to, but it isn't clear.

I completely missed that if that was meant to be the case! So as much as I liked the idea behind the family tree and it's animation, I too would therefore think that link should've been made more explicit. Right I'll try not to just repost yours in full now and say I fully agree with everything that you mentioned and for me the grandfather was easily the best character, though I did like the mother's bratty childhood self as well, the house was brilliant from an architectural aspect but did seem pretty impractical for kids, and the art and animation were generally very good.

Man I wish Hosoda would stop rubbing it in our faces that he has kids. I get it, drawing from personal experience can be important in the creative process, but I just wish his films were more ambitious, and less about his idea of family.

Heheh yeah I think the appeal of this movie was definitely restricted and it felt more like one for the parents and less for those interested in the kiddo's character growth. I do really like the idea of him drawing from his own experiences and family in most of his recent output, though as previously discussed, for me the movies certainly lose some of their magic by the absence of Satoko Okudera.

Also pretty sure Oak Trees can grow massive, those roots would certainly offer structural issues later.

Again agreeing with you on the house, stairway nightmare now that I recall, and very good point on the tree but it was clearly part of the fantasy aspects as well heheh.

I feel largely unconcerned by that kind of marketing, anyway. Unless it's that insidious

I'm OK with it on the whole as well as long it's not too in your face. If a bit of sponsorship that is handled without being ridiculous helps finance things, then I'm for it. I would however not want too much all at once, at least it's not in everything.

I actually didn't mind it at all in Weathering with You, as it made the locations and world a lot more realistic and immersive (I too have enjoyed time in the very real cloud-world just like @D1tchd1gger's experiences as a Wolf Children©), without being in your face. I normally hate product placement but probably because it unrealistically focuses exclusively on only one or two brands in every other scene when done poorly (I'm reminded of Bond movies and blatant BMW and I think Sony product placement in the past).


Have fun all of you going to watch Belle in the cinema. I doubt I'll be able to do likewise but look forward to hearing your spoiler-free opinions!