Has (non-Hentai) Anime become Asexual?
- Thread starter Ark
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Vashdaman
Za Warudo
Yeah I would defo agree with the majority of people here who were saying that anime is certainly just as sexualised as ever(probably more so).
Also while I have never watched Avatar I find it pretty hard to believe that it has more sexual aspects than Naruto. I mean some of the humour in Naruto could be seen as very sexual and questionable indeed, and would never be allowed in Avatar. As for the characters I'm sure the ninja girl fancied that other ninja boy if I recall correctly, and for 10 year olds in a childrens TV show I can't see how one vould really expect them to act more sexually aware.
Also I think your a lil harsh on Eden. Yeah Saki does look younger no doubt(probably more due to the character designers art style more than anything) but I actually respected Eden more for not putting a great emphasis on the sexual side of the relationship like so many other shows would have. There was clearly chemistry evident between the two protagonists and attraction. So out of curiosity what aspects would you have liked to have been included in the show to express the characters sexual maturity more?
Also while I have never watched Avatar I find it pretty hard to believe that it has more sexual aspects than Naruto. I mean some of the humour in Naruto could be seen as very sexual and questionable indeed, and would never be allowed in Avatar. As for the characters I'm sure the ninja girl fancied that other ninja boy if I recall correctly, and for 10 year olds in a childrens TV show I can't see how one vould really expect them to act more sexually aware.
Also I think your a lil harsh on Eden. Yeah Saki does look younger no doubt(probably more due to the character designers art style more than anything) but I actually respected Eden more for not putting a great emphasis on the sexual side of the relationship like so many other shows would have. There was clearly chemistry evident between the two protagonists and attraction. So out of curiosity what aspects would you have liked to have been included in the show to express the characters sexual maturity more?
Let me be clear. When I say asexual I'm talking about the interaction between characters, not sexual imagery/symbolism as a whole (ie Hentai about women getting raped by tentacles are just as asexual in this sense as Ah My Goddess). Naruto has sexual imagery but no sexual tension (except possibly between Sasuke and the snake guy). Avatar has no sexual imagery but does have sexual tension.
I think the animation style is an expression of what I'm talking about to an extent.
I don't know. I just keep comparing it in my mind for reasons of plot similarity to Full Metal Panic where the female protagonist quite clearly has a sexual interest in the male protagonist even though nothing actually develops of it. The point is their interaction isn't like something out of some fairy tale for children. It's mature.
Even in Eva where the characters are only 14 year olds there's still visible and I think quite well portrayed sexual tension. Nowadays, what we get is a bunch of blushing and high pitched stuttering and this is called romance.
A large part of this I think is the Moe influence which transforms women/girls from objects of biological desire who cause tension in men, to objects of cuteness/Kawaii who exist to make men feel relaxed and in a state of harmony. To me that's the real divide. Would you rather portray women solely in a pre/non-sexual state who aren't a challenge to men, or would you rather have women portrayed as they actually are?
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I touched upon it in an earlier post, but I think anime has started pandering to its audience much more and I imagine its to do with the emergence of the internet. Studios can design anime to appeal to a existing audience, and a recent trend in anime is that the characters don't really focus on one-another but merely exist as a tool for the audience to latch onto and create their own worlds (or girlfriends/boyfriends). There's plenty of oppositional shows out there that don't do this and are utterly inspired, and there's also stuff that looks like a conventional 2011 show that features sharper writing and characterisation than you would expect from a show like it, purely due to the negative impression the character designs give off.
Arguably, its not entirely different from the difference in clothing and bodies in the general public now. What looked "normal" in the 1980s is absurd. I'm getting off-topic here, but my point is that although some things have changed, there's still some interesting stuff out there even though its packaged in a weird manner.
I understand generalisations have to be made for this type of thread, but honestly, I think the main "problem" with some of the shows now is that they are simply too self-aware. They don't outright acknowledge the audience, but there's enough going on to to make us aware that some guys heart-and-soul hasn't been poured into this show to get this story out there.
Arguably, its not entirely different from the difference in clothing and bodies in the general public now. What looked "normal" in the 1980s is absurd. I'm getting off-topic here, but my point is that although some things have changed, there's still some interesting stuff out there even though its packaged in a weird manner.
I understand generalisations have to be made for this type of thread, but honestly, I think the main "problem" with some of the shows now is that they are simply too self-aware. They don't outright acknowledge the audience, but there's enough going on to to make us aware that some guys heart-and-soul hasn't been poured into this show to get this story out there.
Vashdaman
Za Warudo
OK fair enough on the Naruto point as I'm sure there isn't any realistic sense of sexual tension. But then again realistic sexual tension clearly isn't Naruto's style. I would have thought Naruto makes it's self clear from the door that in Naruto's world sexual tension=gushing fountain nose bleed( I still don't understand why).
However I have to disagree with you Eden Of The East. First of all I really don't think the art style is very much representative of what you are talking about. Yes the artist who designed the characters(who I believe is a famous manga author) clearly has a less realistic style, and designed both protagonists to have a fairly cute look them. But they don't stray too far into the stupidly cute territory for me(and I generally really dislike over the top exagerated cuteness) and I think the designs fit the series well. To be honest I actually think Saki is a bit more unusual and interesting then many anime feamle leads. Sure she has a fairly cute look to her and is a reserved and quiet character, but she is also more complex and more believeable than half the anime female leads out there. I personally don't think that FMP Kaname character you mentioned looks any more realistic than saki, she is only more busty and has a less round face, if anything I would probably say that Saki is the more realistic looking of the two(even for her age) as she has a more believeable body type, hair style and dress quite maturely.
Also as for the sexual tension in the series I actually thought it was played very well and to an extent believable. The little moments like when Saki was about to text Taki but decided instead to delete the message, or even the kiss to an extent I felt was effective in displaying the chemistry between the two an were relatable moments as well. It was more sutble than most anime. Personally I think their relationship and chemistry was handled far, far better than any of that nonsense going on in EVA
On the other hand the series was also designed to have a very deliberate(clear right from the beginning) fairtale-ish vibe to it in places, so I think it's a wee bit unfair to critisize the show for not being realistic enough in certain areas. None the less whether it be a fairtale or not the show is still has a better rooting in reality than the majority of anime out there.@ Arc's response
However I have to disagree with you Eden Of The East. First of all I really don't think the art style is very much representative of what you are talking about. Yes the artist who designed the characters(who I believe is a famous manga author) clearly has a less realistic style, and designed both protagonists to have a fairly cute look them. But they don't stray too far into the stupidly cute territory for me(and I generally really dislike over the top exagerated cuteness) and I think the designs fit the series well. To be honest I actually think Saki is a bit more unusual and interesting then many anime feamle leads. Sure she has a fairly cute look to her and is a reserved and quiet character, but she is also more complex and more believeable than half the anime female leads out there. I personally don't think that FMP Kaname character you mentioned looks any more realistic than saki, she is only more busty and has a less round face, if anything I would probably say that Saki is the more realistic looking of the two(even for her age) as she has a more believeable body type, hair style and dress quite maturely.
Also as for the sexual tension in the series I actually thought it was played very well and to an extent believable. The little moments like when Saki was about to text Taki but decided instead to delete the message, or even the kiss to an extent I felt was effective in displaying the chemistry between the two an were relatable moments as well. It was more sutble than most anime. Personally I think their relationship and chemistry was handled far, far better than any of that nonsense going on in EVA
On the other hand the series was also designed to have a very deliberate(clear right from the beginning) fairtale-ish vibe to it in places, so I think it's a wee bit unfair to critisize the show for not being realistic enough in certain areas. None the less whether it be a fairtale or not the show is still has a better rooting in reality than the majority of anime out there.@ Arc's response
Vashdaman
Za Warudo
Jayme said:
I do agree with this. There is most certainly too much pandering to the audience and not enough genuine artistic creativity that says something the creators want to say rather than just please a specific audience. Pandering anime has always probably been in the majority but it certainly feels like theres even more of it now. On the other hand I also agree that there are shows which do have sharper writing than you would think considering how the characters are designed. But I'm always really disappointed when that happens because I think "you have half of a really great thing here, yet your letting it be cheapened by pandering to an audience and bashing out tired and potentially exploitative designs". But I guess these days something has to give, right...
Voddas
Symphogear
This thread has been a good read! 
I can see good points on both sides of your arguments but I'd have to agree that anime is in no way become more asexual. I must admit last year I felt the same way as I went threw a stint of anime's that made me think they lacked sexual tension. I've since come to realise that there's such a large spread of anime out there that you can easily wander away from the genre that origianlly attracted you (it's true in my case anyway). I also think your perspective can change with age.
I can see good points on both sides of your arguments but I'd have to agree that anime is in no way become more asexual. I must admit last year I felt the same way as I went threw a stint of anime's that made me think they lacked sexual tension. I've since come to realise that there's such a large spread of anime out there that you can easily wander away from the genre that origianlly attracted you (it's true in my case anyway). I also think your perspective can change with age.
vashdaman said:
My main objection with EoE is that there's no way in hell Saki looks 21 years old. The male characters may have cute designs as well but they still look like they could be their age. Saki's like one step away from being in Kanon. Their relationship didn't really bug me that much as it didn't even really turn non-sexually romantic in the end anyway. It just helped reinforce this stereotype in my mind I guess.
It could be that I'm just seeing the trees and missing the forrest, but I've watched too much stuff in a row recently that has this same problem (even with stuff that's actually good overall).
Vashdaman
Za Warudo
Ark said:
Hmm if by Kanon your referring to that erotic game(great another one!) anime, than I'm sorry even though as you mention Saki is exagerated herself she is no way one step away from being anything like those hyper deformed characters.
I would say there is a significant difference.
Also there was very clearly a romantic element between Saki and Takizawahence the reason he took her up onto the roof at the end,however we will have to wait for the movies to see if it does progress or not
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*Another one"...*sigh*vashdaman said:Hmm if by Kanon your referring to that erotic game(great another one!) anime, than I'm sorry even though as you mention Saki is exagerated herself she is no way one step away from being anything like those hyper deformed characters.
I would say there is a significant difference.
The 2003 version is also one of the first (4th) to get a TV adaptation. This is like the first season since that does not to have one (excluding OVAs).
Itaru Hinoe does give all her designs eyes that take up a quater of the charaters face almost no mouth, and a realy odd shaped head. Has got better over the years though.
Saki has small eyes that have defined pupils and normal abounts of white.
A normal sized mouth.
Normal shaped head
Flat.
Nothing like anyone in Kanon.
Otaku-san
Chuunibyou
Reaper gI said:
Those "white bits" your referring to are the sclera
I read somewhere some time ago that the reason they have such big eye's, is that compared to regular humans, these anime characters have a higher percentage of body water. So to keep this regulated, sunlight decreases the level through the characters eye's.
I can't remember exactly since it was a while back I read this, though I'm positive that it once was on urban dictionary.
It doesn't explain this though:
Sparrowsabre7
Za Warudo
Otaku-san said:Reaper gI said:
Those "white bits" your referring to are the sclera
I read somewhere some time ago that the reason they have such big eye's, is that compared to regular humans, these anime characters have a higher percentage of body water. So to keep this regulated, sunlight decreases the level through the characters eye's.
I can't remember exactly since it was a while back I read this, though I'm positive that it once was on urban dictionary.
It doesn't explain this though:
What about the simpsons? Their pupil to sclera ration is VASTLY greater than anime characters. Maybe that's why they're yellow? they've regulated too much water.