Has anime gone downhill in quality recently?

Nope. Anime is, and always has been subject to Sturgeons Law (90% of it sucking).
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Hmm, maybe. But I guess the key point for many (and me included) is that that 90% is now pure moe filth (sorry for the slightly dramatic language) while in the past I'm guessing that wasn't the case. I have a much higher tolerance for non-moe garbage than I do for moe garbage.
 
Sparrowsabre7 said:
ilmaestro said:
The short answer is "absolutely not" and possibly "this is just a commonly held theory amongst a portion of any non-short term fans of any creative medium".
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That's a much more succinct way of what I was trying to say, so thank you XD
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Aha, reading your post now I have less need to post a longer version of mine. :)

Lawrence said:
To be honest, I do agree to an extent that 90% of anime at the moment isn't that good
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Paradox295 said:
Nope. Anime is, and always has been subject to Sturgeons Law (90% of it sucking).

Difference is, back in the 90's and early 00's, the only shows being distributed (by Toonami and VHS fansubs) were the "best of the best" shows. While, today, nearly everything is available (through Crunchyroll and downloadable fansubs).
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Exactly.
 
I dont necessarily watch every new anime that comes out but i would never say it was because it was a bad anime, as there isn't a bad anime really, just something that's not what you like.

I get what you guy's are saying about the trends of the storyline and that but if im honest i like what i see, mostly!! and in my opinion i can't see any problem in the direction anime is going :)
 
I tend to agree that anime has to make far more effort to appeal to me these days, but I'm not quite sure that is the same thing as it getting worse. Its most likely just changing away from my usual tastes. And in practical terms, that's not necessarily a bad thing: it means I'm not stuck in the unholy situation of trying to watch twenty shows at once, normally just one or two every season, or even, blissfully, none at all!

Helen McCarthy and Chaos also had something to say on this topic on our podcast of a similar title, Is Anime Getting Worse? McCarthy didn't agree with the question and thinks anime is still going strong: http://nakama-britannica.animeuknews.ne ... w-special/
 
Anyone who thinks this way has nostalgia goggles set to maximum and is being selective about current anime to criticise. In other words, they're talking ********.

The problem is the viewers, not the anime. Tastes change over time, so don't blame anime for human behaviour.
 
I think it's a bit more complex than that because of personal taste, or more accurately the obvious prevalence of certain tastes being catered to at the expense of others. If the question is "is there/has there been less objectively good anime being made" then the answer would probably be no. The skills of the artists / directors / writers usually stay fairly consistent in a medium over time.

If the question is "Is there as much anime being made for the demographic who came to anime via the action/sci-fi of the 1990's" then the answer is still no. I don't think it's nostalgia so much as different fans got into anime at different times, when different things were in fashion. Some can roll with the changes and try things outside their usual tastes, others just don't enjoy them or aren't even motivated enough to try.

Edit: and Maxon edited his post to make the point I was making (albeit more bluntly). Ha! At least we can agree on that.
 
MaxonTreik said:
Anyone who thinks this way has nostalgia goggles set to maximum and is being selective about current anime to criticise. In other words, they're talking ********.
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It is very subjective but just because the anime genres are, changing does not mean that it's actually better - or worse. Why would I waste some of my life viewing anime that I know I won't like? It's like selecting what film at the cinema to watch! Somethings you will try but other you just know you won't.

MaxonTreik said:
The problem is the viewers, not the anime. Tastes change over time, so don't blame anime for human behaviour.
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Yes, the problem is actually who they cater for nowadays which has turned the industry somewhat bland. It's not the individual, it's the industry. Look at Hollywood for example, sequels and comic book films galore - they target a specific audience. Anime has now favoured moe a lot more than previously - for increased add on sales of merchandise. In my view, the anime now has decreased in quality. But in your view, it may be that anime is the best it's ever been!

Time to put back on my nostalgia goggles back to max!
 
ayase said:
If the question is "Is there as much anime being made for the demographic who came to anime via the action/sci-fi of the 1990's" then the answer is still no.
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Is it, though? Or is there just so much more else, too, that it looks threadbare by comparison?

Also, I didn't think any anime was objectively good or bad? :s
 
ilmaestro said:
ayase said:
If the question is "Is there as much anime being made for the demographic who came to anime via the action/sci-fi of the 1990's" then the answer is still no.
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Is it, though? Or is there just so much more else, too, that it looks threadbare by comparison?

Also, I didn't think any anime was objectively good or bad? :s
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Well obviously SOME has to be objectively good or bad. That doesn't mean everyone will like it, but some has to be just so poorly made, scripted and voiced that even Satan would call inflicting it on someone a hardship :p

But for the most part, yes it's just people's tastes.
 
It was a call-back to ayase's previously stated view of the existence of objective quality in artistic fields, I agree with your side.
 
ilmaestro said:
It was a call-back to ayase's previously stated view of the existence of objective quality in artistic fields, I agree with your side.
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Heh. I thought you would pick up on that. I cringed as I typed it but it was hard for me to describe what I meant without using that word - That the overall "quality level" of anime as judged by current directing / pacing / scriptwriting standards likely hasn't fallen.

I still don't find it particularly helpful a term though, as it implies judging things based on a pre-determined criterea which is not really objective in nature, due to being developed over time (presumably by critics) and being more what makes a "traditionally" good piece of art in the eyes of establised cultural elite. It doesn't change my belief that so called "objective" views of art are really just subjective views held over a long enough period or by influential enough people that a kind of "Emperor's new clothes" scenario takes over whereby people presume they must be wrong for not liking certain things; or even pretend to like things because they fit the established criterea.
 
Sparrowsabre7 said:
ilmaestro said:
ayase said:
If the question is "Is there as much anime being made for the demographic who came to anime via the action/sci-fi of the 1990's" then the answer is still no.
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Is it, though? Or is there just so much more else, too, that it looks threadbare by comparison?

Also, I didn't think any anime was objectively good or bad? :s
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Well obviously SOME has to be objectively good or bad.
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But you can't define objectivity in an objective matter. It's impossible. You can't prove anything in art as fact because by it's very nature art is subjective.
 
MaxonTreik said:
But you can't define objectivity in an objective matter. It's impossible. You can't prove anything in art as fact because by it's very nature art is subjective.
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I to agree with Maxon, there is no possible way to define whats a good or bad anime it is completely up to the person who is watching it and there for will be of a different view from you :roll: silly didnt you no?
 
I can define objectively bad anime in one sentence: The kind that has frequent (and often somewhat explicit) sexualisation on 13 yr old anime children, so that the creators can pander to/cash in on/ further exasperate a mostly male demographic that really is in need of help. It's wrong in every way.
 
vashdaman said:
I can define objectively bad anime in one sentence: The kind that has frequent (and often somewhat explicit) sexualisation on 13 yr old anime children, so that the creators can pander to/cash in on/ further exasperate a mostly male demographic that really is in need of help. It's wrong in every way.
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But that's not objective, you're putting a spin on that. I must confess I agree that the whole lolicon, toddlercon thing is more than a little disturbing to me, but some people dig that. Plus that's not even a facet of the plot or whatever, I'm not sure it could make an anime inherently bad.
 
Those shows only have a negative and harmful impact on human kind, therefore I would say no matter how good the artwork or scripting is, it is still inherently bad.

Of course, I am creating my own definitions here and my last post wasn't really meant to be taken overly seriously. But yeah, those shows are just wrongful, unfortunately a high percentage of all current anime seems to fall into that category.
 
Sparrowsabre7 said:
But that's not objective, you're putting a spin on that. I must confess I agree that the whole lolicon, toddlercon thing is more than a little disturbing to me, but some people dig that. Plus that's not even a facet of the plot or whatever, I'm not sure it could make an anime inherently bad.
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Sorry, but any fanservice (in a sexual way) is going to be worse than something that is more subtle and plot-driven - unless you like your anime that way!

Trying hard not to derail the thread into why lolicon is wrong - but it is comments like ' some people dig lolicon' which help retain the status quo, which also helps moe styled anime being bought and therefore bringing down the 'quality' - in my very subjective view. Sorry I'm just not interested in characters that look way too young for their age with lots of pantsu shots to be a 'waifu' for male viewers. It just doesn't help the image of anime in general.
 
^
For reals. I think that kind of pandering is a major factor as to why anime is not as accepted over here as it could be. I know there are other cultural factors which makes it harder for many westerners to 'get' anime, but I think constantly living up to it's negative stereotype is one of the biggest barriers to westerners, who likely just get creeped out by that stuff.

Of course anime is still primarily made for Japanese people, so I guess until the next gen otaku get tired of seeing school children panties (surely panty fatigue must be starting to set in now?!) things won't change (and nor should they just change solely for western tastes).

Mind you, I have to say that I am still happy enough with the few gems that we get every season or so. We still do get some great quality stuff and things could a lot worse.
 
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