Does your manga need to be Japanese?

D

Dracos

Dragon Knight
Today I bought volume 3 of Tokyopops The Dreaming by Queenie Chan, who was originally from Hong Kong and now lives in Australia. And it got me thinking for some people does the Manga they read have to be from Japanese writers and artists or is the story and the style more important than where it is from.

Does it matter that more and more western writers and artists like Alice LeGrow who does Bizenghast are attracted to the writing and drawing style of manga. Do you think western manga does not work as it is lacking real Japanese influence or can you just appreciate it may be a little different. I wonder if any western manga has been translated into Japanese and whether the people reading it realised it was not native to Japan.

What about Korean Manhwa titles like XS Hybrid by Song Ji-Hyung or Banya The Explosive Delivery Man by Kim Young-Oh. With cheaper wages and less Japanese people going into Anime and Manga production more of the art work is being done in Korea. So does it diminish peoples enjoyment that the story might be Japanese but the art work may not be.

Have a look at your manga collections you may be surprised :eek:, I was when I realised I had more Western Manga and Korean Manga/Manhwa than I realised.
 
Definitly prefer my manga as its just so unique and differently paced and branches out into uncountable genres although Im a big supporter of the potential of Global manga and hope to be published myself someday, Id love to hear other opinions on this.
 
As far as I'm concerned, if it's not Japanese, it's not manga...it's a comic, the same way as X-Men or Batman is.

I got the Best New Manga book a while ago, and I'm amazed at some of the stuff publishers can get away with calling "manga". Seriously...half of it is just standard webcomics. You might as well call Penny Arcade or CTRL+ALT+DEL manga. Or like...Calvin & Hobbes. =/

Even when Neo has these "world manga" artists drawing stuff, I don't think most of it looks like this mythical "manga style". I can appreciate that they're (mostly) very nice pictures, but they're no different to the pictures supermarkets put on the packaging for kids' ready meals as far as I'm concerned.

A burger van at a summer fair can call its burgers Whoppers (besides y'know...trademarks), but that doesn't mean it's actually the same as a delicious Whopper from Burger King...
 
Well, generally, I do prefer my manga to be from Japan, yes. I hate the whole "weaboo" crap, but in all honesty, anime and manga are so unique because they are from Japan. If you take Japan out of manga and anime, then it's not really anime or manga.

I can always, always tell when a 'manga' isn't from Japan. Sure, Sweatdrop studios done a good job with manga Shakespeare, but the art was most certainly not up to the standards of most manga. It just looked like a knock-off, to be honest.
 
Aaron said:
As far as I'm concerned, if it's not Japanese, it's not manga...it's a comic, the same way as X-Men or Batman is.

I got the Best New Manga book a while ago, and I'm amazed at some of the stuff publishers can get away with calling "manga". Seriously...half of it is just standard webcomics. You might as well call Penny Arcade or CTRL+ALT+DEL manga. Or like...Calvin & Hobbes. =/

Even when Neo has these "world manga" artists drawing stuff, I don't think most of it looks like this mythical "manga style". I can appreciate that they're (mostly) very nice pictures, but they're no different to the pictures supermarkets put on the packaging for kids' ready meals as far as I'm concerned.

A burger van at a summer fair can call its burgers Whoppers (besides y'know...trademarks), but that doesn't mean it's actually the same as a delicious Whopper from Burger King...
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"If its not Japanese its not manga"
Well sorry but it is, just not Japanese manga, manga is just the japanese name for comics, comics which come in many styles far and away from the typical manga style.
 
Outlawstar said:
"If its not Japanese its not manga"
Well sorry but it is, just not Japanese manga, manga is just the japanese name for comics, comics which come in many styles far and away from the typical manga style.
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Do you call The Beano manga? :?
 
CitizenGeek said:
Well, generally, I do prefer my manga to be from Japan, yes. I hate the whole "weaboo" crap, but in all honesty, anime and manga are so unique because they are from Japan. If you take Japan out of manga and anime, then it's not really anime or manga.

I can always, always tell when a 'manga' isn't from Japan. Sure, Sweatdrop studios done a good job with manga Shakespeare, but the art was most certainly not up to the standards of most manga. It just looked like a knock-off, to be honest.
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I also prefer my manga from Japan without doubt, and agree that its because its from Japan that makes it unique, the way they make comics is much better in my opinion than westerners, but thats starting to change, its not like we can just say were not allowed to imitate the way ther make comics, it happens in all walks of life.


I also agree that a lot of world manga is not up to the standards of the best manga, but its early days yet and considering the amount of manga in japan, Im sure theres a lot of crap, just like anime.
 
Aaron said:
Outlawstar said:
"If its not Japanese its not manga"
Well sorry but it is, just not Japanese manga, manga is just the japanese name for comics, comics which come in many styles far and away from the typical manga style.
Click to expand...
Do you call The Beano manga? :?
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No, but the Japanese would, we just associate manga with japanese comics because its the name for it there.
Just like we say creme brule, not burnt cream.
 
Outlawstar said:
No, but the Japanese would, we just associate manga with japanese comics because its the name for it there.
Just like we say creme brule, not burnt cream.
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I use the words "manga" and "comics" to distinguish between what I see as two different things.

I know they're both grids of pictures with speech bubbles and sound effects and whatever, but as far as I'm concerned if they're not Japanese, nor even look Japanese, it's a joke calling them by the Japanese language name for them.

We don't call creme brulee "burnt cream", because it's a friggin' UGLY name for something people are supposed to want to eat. It's like how the marketing people can slap "manga" on any old stuff and people will buy it because they think it's different.

It's not even a similar comparison to manga vs. comics anyway (off topic completely, but whatever)...

Wikipedia said:
Origins of the dessert are in dispute among Britain, France, Germany, The Czech Republic, and Spain. It appeared in France in François Massialot's 1691 cookbook,[1] and the French name was used in the English translation of this book, but the 1731 edition of Massialot's Cuisine roial et bourgeoise changed the name of the same recipe from "crème brulée" to "crème à l'Angloise". [2] In the early eighteenth century, the dessert was called "burnt cream" in English.[3]
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So yeah...a 300-year-old translation for a foodstuff that might not even originate from the country where the language it's named in comes from... =/
 
Aaron said:
Outlawstar said:
No, but the Japanese would, we just associate manga with japanese comics because its the name for it there.
Just like we say creme brule, not burnt cream.
Click to expand...
I use the words "manga" and "comics" to distinguish between what I see as two different things.

I know they're both grids of pictures with speech bubbles and sound effects and whatever, but as far as I'm concerned if they're not Japanese, nor even look Japanese, it's a joke calling them by the Japanese language name for them.

We don't call creme brulee "burnt cream", because it's a friggin' UGLY name for something people are supposed to want to eat. It's like how the marketing people can slap "manga" on any old stuff and people will buy it because they think it's different.

It's not even a similar comparison to manga vs. comics anyway (off topic completely, but whatever)...

Wikipedia said:
Origins of the dessert are in dispute among Britain, France, Germany, The Czech Republic, and Spain. It appeared in France in François Massialot's 1691 cookbook,[1] and the French name was used in the English translation of this book, but the 1731 edition of Massialot's Cuisine roial et bourgeoise changed the name of the same recipe from "crème brulée" to "crème à l'Angloise". [2] In the early eighteenth century, the dessert was called "burnt cream" in English.[3]
Click to expand...

So yeah...a 300-year-old translation for a foodstuff that might not even originate from the country where the language it's named in comes from... =/
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I was just using it as an example for the situation, not to be disected, the general meaning of what Im getting across is in here.

Listen, I actually call japanese manga...manga, and everything else comics, Im not saying otherwise, all Im saying is that the japanese dont distinguish as harshly, although some do.

As for not calling things manga because they dont look like manga, well there are many comics in japan that dont look like manga.....yet are.
 
Is there maybe an analogous for manga like where in Japan anime just means all animation even Disney type stuff, unlike in the west where we jump on labelling things and use anime to refer to animation only made in Japan or done in a Japanese style originally for a Japanese audience. I wonder if the fans in the west are making a bigger deal of these things than the Japanese or whether like in some countries there is a movement to maintain in this case manga as a cultural identity. It would be amusing to imagine a forum in Japan where people are arguing whether or not they feel manga is getting stale and should take in some more inspiration from the rest of the world.

I mentioned Korean Manhwa in my original post and am now starting to wonder if there are people that feel as strongly about it remaining identifiably Korean with it drawing on the culture and history of its home land, as people do about manga and its Japanese origin and history.
 
I'm happy to read comics in general so the boundaries between various terms don't bother me so much. I like Japanese stuff for sure, but there's still good stuff going on further afield I like to check out every now and then.

Comics are comics. Calling it 'graphic novels' or 'manga' doesn't really make a difference imo.
 
Outlawstar said:
"If its not Japanese its not manga"
Well sorry but it is, just not Japanese manga, manga is just the japanese name for comics, comics which come in many styles far and away from the typical manga style.
Click to expand...

The word 'manga' might have it's origins in the Japanese language, and it might mean 'comics' in that language, but when it's English meaning is very definitely "comics from Japan". That's the reason no one ever calls Batman or Fantastic 4 'manga' in English.

I think it would be better if manwha and 'OEL manga' were not passed off as 'manga', to be honest. It's just misleading. Certainly, there's good manwha and OEL manga out there (well, there probably is, I've yet to experience it), but trying to brand it as 'manga' is unfair to the consumer, IMO.
 
I don't own any manga thats non-japanese well I don't think i do personally as long as the story rocks and the design is brilliant I will read pretty much anything
 
Some good arguments so far.

I agree with CitizenGeek about it being unfair to consumers to label things Manga that maybe are not just as a marketing tool to sell it because manga is becoming more popular.

Do people feel they are limiting themselves and maybe missing out on a good story because they just won't read anything that is not authentic Japanese manga.

I myself have had a heavy addiction (£150 a month approx) to western comics of all types for years and now because of my addiction to anime I have in the last few years started to buy more manga. I like the deeper stories in manga(which some western comics also have) and the art but here it can be a bit hit or miss as in anything. The thing is because of my love for comics of all types I won't discriminate against Non-Japanese manga I will read them and give them a chance. But as some have said here I would probably think to myself I would have not classed that as manga. Some of the Non-Japanese manga I have read has probably had better stories and art than some of the second rate Japanese Manga I have also seen, so is it really a lesser thing just because it is not Japanese or should it be looked at in its own right.

What do people here feel about some of the western titles like Spawn and Witchblade that have been re-visioned by Japanese writers and artists for the Japanese market. I have both of these and find it quite amusing to take a western idea turn it into manga and then translate it back.
 
OEL manga and manwha should be sold on their own merits, not passed off as manga. I read manga because I don't find Western comics (DC Comics, Marvel etc.) appealing. The definition of manga is important, and it shouldn't be blurred with OEL manga and manwha.

What do people here feel about some of the western titles like Spawn and Witchblade that have been re-visioned by Japanese writers and artists for the Japanese market. I have both of these and find it quite amusing to take a western idea turn it into manga and then translate it back.
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I haven't seen either of those, but I'm sure they could turn out well. Le Comte De Monte Cristo was re-imagined by Gonzo and that turned out well, apparently.
 
I don't think Manga need to be Japanese. I think of Manga as a certain kind of art that differs from the usual western comic.

So if its a manga from Britain, I call it British manga. If it's from... let's say Australia. I call it Australian manga. I call it Manga based on it's art, not where it comes from.
 
CitizenGeek said:
OEL manga and manwha should be sold on their own merits, not passed off as manga. I read manga because I don't find Western comics (DC Comics, Marvel etc.) appealing. The definition of manga is important, and it shouldn't be blurred with OEL manga and manwha.
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I think may be in a few years with more coverage the average reader may have more knowledge about what authentic Japanese Manga is, what World Manga is and what Manhwa is, but until then the western publishers and retailers will lump it together as they think it is similar so people that buy one may want to buy the rest. I know some publishers are marketing Manhwa as Manhwa as it is slowely getting bigger in the west and peoples knowledge is changing, hopefully they wil start doing the same with World Manga as it really should have a seperate place and help the less than fanatical out there make a choice.
 
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