Politics

[SciFiBoy!]

the basic stuff that will affect who i vote for is Proportional Representation (fairer voting system), more Socialist economic policy (more regulation, progressive taxation) and more freedom (repealing all thoose "aniti terror" laws and stuff)

ill vote for a party thats in favour of thoose things and a few more (cant think of right now as im sleepy)

 

[CitizenGeek]

i vote to return to absolute monarchy

If this were to be introduced (again) then the citizens of the United Kingdom will have no say, and will be forced to abide by Her Majesty's laws as opposed to the actual citizens themselves, from each constituency, creating "Bills" to give to the government as ideas for new laws that they think should be introduced..a power the Monarchy has not beared in years. Even when they did, they were only always killed and betrayed by their fellow people anyway.

Whoa, are you serious? I think everyone understands the idea of absolute monarchy and excessively basic definitions are not required. Besides, it's obvious Ryo Chan was joking.

 

[chaos]

I'm in favour or gettingthe iron lady back. Or maybe creating a clone of Churchill...

Seriously, I'm in favour of politicians that makes sense and have a long term plan. Being hit badly by a populist law myself, I must say that ruling only to get votes is exactly what the nazis did to get to power. Then, they convinced everyone in German that all non-arians were to blame and I believe you know followed... =(

 

[CitizenGeek]

It's sad that Britain and Ireland are the only EU countries not in the Schengen Area.

Well, the UK and Ireland are both island nations and as such, I don't think the open borders policies would work as well as it's much more difficult to police island borders.

 

[ayase]

I don't 100% agree with some of what you've said but this part was right on.

Oh God, you have a friend or relative who's a customs officer don't you?

Feel free to speak your mind though Rui. Whenever anyone says "I don't agree with something you said" I'm always itching to know what that something is!

I quite liked the last LibDem guy - unfortunately. I agree that the current one doesn't particularly thrill me but he still beats out Gordon Brown (who seems nice enough but genuinely has no charisma whatsoever) and David Cameron (who somehow always looks shifty and disconnected from modern realities). We could really use someone with presence leading our country though, such a shame.

Hmm, on Lib Dem leaders I always liked Charles Kennedy best. He seemed like a really genuine guy who brought the Liberals to renewed prominence. I still think he would have made a great Prime Minister. Who cares if he got drunk? Hasn't anyone ever heard of Boris Yeltsin? I know charisma plays a big part in being elected, but if people looked at these things rationally (ha!) they should choose based on who is the most capable, not who has the nicest smile. On this note I'm going to predict David Miliband (Blair Mk.2) as next leader of the Labour party and next Labour prime Minister, after Cameron's had a couple of terms. Unless of course Boris Johnson manages to gain control of the Tories at some point in which case God help us all.

Well, the UK and Ireland are both island nations and as such, I don't think the open borders policies would work as well as it's much more difficult to police island borders.

I watched a hilarious Parliamentary Select Committee hearing the other week when they quizzed the Army and Coastguard about the threat of terrorists coming in by sea and doing things like blowing up nuclear power stations. The politicians were hysterical about this "threat" but the coastguard seemed to keep inferring "Do you know what a ridiculous concept it is for us to be constantly surveying the entire coastline?" If Iceland and all the Mediterranean islands can be in Schengen, so can we. I've also yet to see a valid explanation why the UK's coast is any harder to protect than say, Spain's or Italy's. I think our government is just enjoying controlling us through fear of terrorists too much at the moment, and I think this would be the same were they Labour or Tory.

 

[CitizenGeek]

But Ireland opts out of the Schengen agreement too, so it's obviously not just about the terrorist threat. Those are fair points, though and the UK opting out of this free travel treaty is starting to puzzle me. I know why Ireland opts out though: if Ireland were to join Schengen, the free travel agreement with the UK would have to end and Ireland would have to place checkpoints along the N. Irish border and would loose the benefits of free travel to the UK.

 

[Rui]

Feel free to speak your mind though Rui. Whenever anyone says "I don't agree with something you said" I'm always itching to know what that something is!

The things I disagree on are, I'm afraid to say, the extent of the civil liberties you want, though I understand and respect your stance too. I'm very strongly against antisocial habits such as smoking (to pick an inflammatory one) and wouldn't mind at all sacrificing some of my own freedoms to be rid of that absolutely disgusting addiction some people have. Particularly topical right now as my neighbour smokes in his own house each morning out of the window, which happens to be right next to my bathroom window, meaning I just endured a disgusting-smelling shower ten minutes ago and still can't get the foul, poisonous odour out of my memory. When I sit down on a park bench with a sandwich and moments later someone zooms over to sit next to me and lights up, I see red.

I believe in freedom, but draw a very firm line where freedom comes at the expense of other human beings. I'd also privately like for groups such as the BNP to have less freedom to stir up racist feelings...I don't want to censor them so much as just throw all the racists into a big cave away from me until they learn to see that running the world is a group effort.

But if we all agreed life would be boring, I suppose!

I agree on Kennedy - even blind drunk I'd take him over some of these other folks

R

 

[Tachi]

now as my neighbour smokes in his own house each morning out of the window, which happens to be right next to my bathroom window, meaning I just endured a disgusting-smelling shower ten minutes ago and still can't get the foul, poisonous odour out of my memory. When I sit down on a park bench with a sandwich and moments later someone zooms over to sit next to me and lights up, I see red.

R

Close the window? i agree its not fair though....if he's not going to smoke in his house properly then he should just stand outside and do it...atleast then it can air out abit....less chance of sneaking into your window
not a bench....but walking through the high street i've had ignorant people walking past me and i'm pleasantly welcomed by a facefull of smoke....inconsiderate bastards.

It'd be nice to have someone who can listen to the people....and actually follow through with the promises they've made.....someone mentioned getting maggy back....well maybe we should have another woman as PM....

 

[MaxonTreik]

Lib Dem here.

the day we let a scott take over england....was the day we mucked up.

:roll: I know. A UK citizen running the UK. Such a bizarre concept!

 

[BlackWolf]

To be fair to tach he was joking about that part

 

[shira]

Particularly topical right now as my neighbour smokes in his own house each morning out of the window, which happens to be right next to my bathroom window, meaning I just endured a disgusting-smelling shower ten minutes ago and still can't get the foul, poisonous odour out of my memory. When I sit down on a park bench with a sandwich and moments later someone zooms over to sit next to me and lights up, I see red.

Lets be fair though; it's his house. Surely you could try the 'polite word with him' approach? Just say "I have a shower in the mornings, so if you could just wait till later to have a cigarette at the window, i'd appreciate it", or take your shower after his morning cigarette? My parents used to smoke and I know the morning cigarette was always about the same time.

As for the park bench incident, at least its outside? The smoking ban has made it nice for you inside!

 

[Rui]

Lets be fair though; it's his house. Surely you could try the 'polite word with him' approach? Just say "I have a shower in the mornings, so if you could just wait till later to have a cigarette at the window, i'd appreciate it", or take your shower after his morning cigarette? My parents used to smoke and I know the morning cigarette was always about the same time.

As for the park bench incident, at least its outside? The smoking ban has made it nice for you inside!

For sure, I love the smoking ban! I just wish it wasn't necessary and that people wouldn't fill my air with dirt out of actual consideration

I'm hoping with the weather getting nicer he'll start going out in the garden to do it again, though it's still gross.

R

 

[fabio de lunatico]

I voted Labour in the previous two elections, but I've become so disillusioned with politics over the last few years that I'm going to abstain at the next one. I must be getting old.

Regarding the smoking ban, that's stands as one of Labour's few successes. The civil liberties argument is a persuasive one, and in an ideal world people wouldn't need to be forced to behave responsibly. Nobody has the right to endanger the health of other people and goverments have an obligation to protect its citizens.

 

[ayase]

I imagine I'll be on the wrong side of history anyway, but I just don't like personal decisions being taken out of the hands of individuals. The way I look at it everybody should have a choice whether or not they drink, smoke, have an abortion, carry a firearm (the left and right both hate me ). I would prefer everybody to be in control of their own lives and only interfered with by the law at the point that they actually cause someone else harm. I admit this is a tough one with smoking, but as far as I know no-one is forced into the company of smokers.

Education plays a big part in this of course. If people know that abusing drugs, cigarettes and alcohol (rather than simply using) will kill them they are less likely to do it. If people are taught to be responsible with contraception and firearms they are less likely to have unwanted children and shoot people - it's just that our personal and social (along with every other sort of) education here in the UK is terrible. I don't think anyone has got this right yet. America has good levels of personal freedom (apart from when it comes to drugs) but terrible education. Continental Europe has for the most part good education but less personal freedom. And the good ol' UK of GB and NI has the worst of both worlds. Hooray...

 

[SciFiBoy!]

I imagine I'll be on the wrong side of history anyway, but I just don't like personal decisions being taken out of the hands of individuals. The way I look at it everybody should have a choice whether or not they drink, smoke, have an abortion, carry a firearm (the left and right both hate me ). I would prefer everybody to be in control of their own lives and only interfered with by the law at the point that they actually cause someone else harm. I admit this is a tough one with smoking, but as far as I know no-one is forced into the company of smokers.

Education plays a big part in this of course. If people know that abusing drugs, cigarettes and alcohol (rather than simply using) will kill them they are less likely to do it. If people are taught to be responsible with contraception and firearms they are less likely to have unwanted children and shoot people - it's just that our personal and social (along with every other sort of) education here in the UK is terrible. I don't think anyone has got this right yet. America has good levels of personal freedom (apart from when it comes to drugs) but terrible education. Continental Europe has for the most part good education but less personal freedom. And the good ol' UK of GB and NI has the worst of both worlds. Hooray...

apart from the guns i agree with you, thats because the only reason i can see for someone having a gun is to cause harm

 

[fabio de lunatico]

I admit this is a tough one with smoking, but as far as I know no-one is forced into the company of smokers.

Not forced, no, but everyone should have the right -- the freedom -- to visit and work in public places without having to inhale a lung full of carcinogens. I'm perfectly happy for people to drink or smoke themselves into early grave if that's what they desire, but they shouldn't be allowed to inflict their nihilism on others. Does anybody complain about not being able to smoke on public transport any more? My view is that in years to come, smoking in pubs and clubs will be viewed as just as socially unnaceptable.

Limitless personal freedom is great in principle but it just doesn't work. Even in the US you can't drive at whatever speed you want, or have sex in full view of the public, or run screaming through the local mall brandishing a samurai sword. I agree with most of what you wrote in your second paragraph, though I believe that the vast majority of smokers and drinkers are already well aware of how harmful their habit is. Many people either seem to think they've invincible until it's too late, or actually enjoy flirting with death.

 

[skikes]

If I was a UK citizen

arent you from northern ireland?

 

[CitizenGeek]

I admit this is a tough one with smoking, but as far as I know no-one is forced into the company of smokers.

Not forced, no, but everyone should have the right -- the freedom -- to visit and work in public places without having to inhale a lung full of carcinogens. I'm perfectly happy for people to drink or smoke themselves into early grave if that's what they desire, but they shouldn't be allowed to inflict their nihilism on others. Does anybody complain about not being able to smoke on public transport any more? My view is that in years to come, smoking in pubs and clubs will be viewed as just as socially unacceptable.

Totally agree with all of this. Smoking was outlawed in public places a few years ago here in Ireland and the country is better for it. No one ever complains about it, either. It's only a matter of time before the rest of the world catches up.

If I was a UK citizen

arent you from northern ireland?

Nope, I'm from the Republic. Fairly deep south of Ireland, as a matter of fact

Northern Irish people don't still elect representatives to Westminster, do they? :s

 

[ayase]

I admit this is a tough one with smoking, but as far as I know no-one is forced into the company of smokers.

Not forced, no, but everyone should have the right -- the freedom -- to visit and work in public places without having to inhale a lung full of carcinogens. I'm perfectly happy for people to drink or smoke themselves into early grave if that's what they desire, but they shouldn't be allowed to inflict their nihilism on others. Does anybody complain about not being able to smoke on public transport any more? My view is that in years to come, smoking in pubs and clubs will be viewed as just as socially unacceptable.

What I'm more worried about is when it becomes socially unacceptable to drink in pubs. Or not join in with pastimes enjoyed by the majority, or not take your Soma. People often roll their eyes at this argument because you can't make someone passively drunk - but let's be honest, alcohol also causes health problems, and certainly far more social problems than tobacco. I don't like the idea of making anything other than intentional physical or verbal abuse of other individuals socially unacceptable. Yes, I'm all for public nudity, profanity and blasphemy too. As I say though, I'm sure history will prove you right and me wrong. Enjoy your obstacle golf when you get there.

Even in the US you can't drive at whatever speed you want, or have sex in full view of the public, or run screaming through the local mall brandishing a samurai sword.

Yeah, good point. Why the hell not? I demand the right to drive down a motorway at whatever speed I like whilst having sex and brandishing a samurai sword!

Northern Irish people don't still elect representatives to Westminster, do they? :s

Yep. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Parliamentary_constituencies_in_Northern_Ireland Wouldn't be much of a United Kingdom without them would it?

 

[kupocake]

the lib dems seem pretty useless though

Fair Enough.

so im thinking about voting for the Green party

*facepalm*

See this is why we should adopt a policy like in a gundam show, you know like getting rid of all world borders...it would get rid of a lot of problems

I thought Gundam foreign policy was 'drop an asteroid on the earth to punish those whose souls are weighed down by gravity'? But yeah, migration to space is fair enough. No need to push the green agenda if we're all in air-conditioned space colonies. It just becomes a problem when the Space BNP declare sovereignty and start dropping them from the sky.

Limitless personal freedom is great in principle but it just doesn't work. Even in the US

You say it like Personal Freedom and the US go hand in hand. The UK and most of the EU are far more progressive (everything from Sexuality and Gender rights to earlier drinking, driving and legal sex ages), and the US is bogged down in some pretty ridiculous debates that don't even remotely figure in our parliament (Creationist agendas in schools, Pro-Life influences on abortion rights). So basically, they only have more 'liberal' smoking and gun-ownership rights that ultimately come down to far-right conservative/capitalist agendas.

Oh, and without smoking in pubs, they do indeed stink of puke and piss instead.

I'm pretty sure at this stage that the Tories will win the next election, if only because voters have the mentality that if you switch parties enough, someone will eventually have all the answers. Any leader in Brown's position would have made the same mistakes, though I imagine most of them could have managed a little more grace.