Japanese Earthquake and Tsunami. Yoko Kanno tribute

[Ryo Chan]

On March 11th at around 14:46 Local time (05:46 GMT) the largest earthquake to hit Japan on records caused heavy damage to the North East of Japan, and caused a deadly Tsunami which has caused billions in damage and a loss of life set to reach into the 1,000
 
After effects have left Nuclear plants in risk of meltdown and oil refineries ablaze, leading to power and fuel shortages.
 
Many countries have sent specialist volunteer groups to help the victims of Japan, but all they can do is support the needs of those left homeless in the short run and help save those who are trapped as a result of the devastating earthquake.
 
What we as fellow members of this planet can do to help the people of Japan is donate to fund the hard working charities out there who aren't helping because of a need or sense of duty, but because they wish to help fellow civilians of this planet to rebuild and try and move on from these events.
If you wish to donate any amount to help the people of Japan, the following sites are available of citizens of the United Kingdom to send help to our Japanese Brethren
 
<a href="http://www.redcross.org.uk/Donate-Now/Make-a-single-donation/Disaster-Fund">The British Red Cross</a>
<a href="http://www.shelterbox.org/donate.php">Shelter Box</a>
<a href="https://www.worldvision.org.uk/server.php?show=nav.3001&giftId=8">World Vision</a>
<a href="http://www.crunchyroll.com/deals/japan-earthquake-donation-fund-391">Crunchyroll</a> (Will match any donation made up to $5000/£3000)
 
Update: Yoko Kanno has also recorded a song in tribute to people of Japan

 

[Jaymii]

Completely forgot the "announcement" post existed. I like the CrunchyRoll donation thing, I haven't done anything yet so I may as well use them.

 

[Ryo Chan]

Completely forgot the "announcement" post existed. I like the CrunchyRoll donation thing, I haven't done anything yet so I may as well use them.

not something i like to use, it's a pain lol

but yeah donated £40 via cruchy yesterday myself

 

[Reaper gI]

Another nuclear plant in Ibaraki is having problems cooling and also after several weeks of no activity in the Shinmoedake volcano in southern japan, it has began blowing out ash and rocks.

It seems to be that the problem is now, no-one can agree how bad a melt down in the reactors will be. Some sources site this as chernobyl 2.0, however others site the situation as being nothing close to that.

It's not a Soviet reactor, Chernobyl cannot happen, end of story.

It has a negative void coeficent (reaction will stop if if boils off it's coolant, even without control rods), and containment (like any non-Soviet (or some British*) reactors): both unlike Chernobyl

Meltdown is the worst case scenario, possibly another Three Mile Island.
The reactors are write offs, but no real danger outside the plant.

*ours use gas coolant, which won't get the huge pressure increase from boiling, and can survive loss of coolant normaly

 

[MaxonTreik]

How do you change the amount you donate via Crunchyroll? I don't see any options to increase the amount from $5.00.

 

[MaxonTreik]

How do you change the amount you donate via Crunchyroll? I don't see any options to increase the amount from $5.00.

When you check out, you change the quantity of the donation being made, in installments of $5.

Oh I see.

Made my contribution now.

 

[Reaper gI]

If NHK is right we may have a containment breach a Fukushima Daiiichi unit 2 reactor.
That's a worst case scenareo.

As it's already near certain that some cladding on the fuel rods has gone containment will contain fission products of the Uranium, some of which are realy nasty.

 

[Reaper gI]

tl;dr version, yes they're the same thing chernobyl spewed out, but much less likely to be spread anything like as badly. Small amounts may have escaped, as with TMI.

They're supposed to be venting some slightly radioactive gases from the continment (maybe some Cs and I-131 in there, see below). (the US Navy said they'd detected some of them) You get them from the cooling water absorbing some neutrons.
Also that's where the hydrogen that caused the explosions of reactor 1 and 3's buildings came out, you get it produced by steam reacting with the zirconium that the outside of fuel rods are made of.

It's the caesium and iodine-131 from the actual fission reaction that are realy dangerous, which are what got released by Chernobyl in large amounts. There should now be an amount of them in the water within the primary cooling loop, and in the continment (as excess pressure in the primary loop/reaction vessel vents there).

If we get a steam explosion in the primary loop (like Chernobyl), and then continment doesn't hold it's big trouble.

Uranium or plutonium escaping would be worse the Chernobyl, that requires full core meltdown. i.e. to have enough heat left to melt through the main reactor vessel, which Three Mile Island showed is very unlikely (Chernobyl's reactor hadn't been shut down, so that's differnt).
Then the containment has to fail.

As you may notice all the big problems need emergancy cooling to fail again (so it keeps getting too hot and/or high pressure) and then containment to fail.

 

[Vashdaman]

I just don't understand at all how these scientist's or whoever it is that decides to build these nuclear plant things, would be so stupid to think it would be a good idea and safe to build them in a place that is on a massive fault line and is prone to earthquakes and such. It's just the worst idea in the world.

 

[Reaper gI]

I just don't understand at all how these scientist's or whoever it is that decides to build these nuclear plant things, would be so stupid to think it would be a good idea and safe to build them in a place that is on a massive fault line and is prone to earthquakes and such. It's just the worst idea in the world.

They're built to withstand a 8.2E eathquake and a 6.5 metre tsunami as a worst case.
Got hit by an 9.0E (5 times stronger) and a 7 metre tsunami.

It's the absolute worst case scenario for that type of plant:
It lost 3 different sets of backup power:
the nearby hydroelectric dam,
Then the diesel pumps
the emergancy batteries run out after 8 hours anyway.

Most of it's main defences are still working fine
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Loss_of_coolant_accident
We're on final defence 2. But have got coolant running again.
3 is likely to hold fine; enough cooling should have already been done.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boiling_water_reactor_safety_systems
HPCI, and RCIC, failed
LPCS has been stoped as it's past the point it's useful.

ADS is in use, hence the suppression pool (where it got damgaged) being under pressure.
Primary containment (steel drywell) is considered to be okay as is the secondary (dirty great effing block of steel reinforced concrete), they're leaking some gas from the suppression pool to the steel reinforced concrete around it. They think the initial burst may have let some through, but it's now not so big a problem.

 

[Ryo Chan]

I just don't understand at all how these scientist's or whoever it is that decides to build these nuclear plant things, would be so stupid to think it would be a good idea and safe to build them in a place that is on a massive fault line and is prone to earthquakes and such. It's just the worst idea in the world.

cause building windfarms is a much better idea lol

 

[Vashdaman]

Huh. Well actually yeah it probably is.

I would much rather have it that way than have the population of the country at risk of being exposed to a nuclear outbreak. wouldn't you?

Nothing is worth that kind of danger to the people.

 

[Ryo Chan]

Huh. Well actually yeah it probably is.

I would much rather have it that way than have the population of the country at risk of being exposed to a nuclear outbreak. wouldn't you?

Nothing is worth that kind of danger to the people.

u'd rather the enitre population of Japan lived without electricity after every tsunami than just a area of it then?

Windfarms need to be by the sea to have any real effect, how else is Japan supose to suport it's electrical needs

 

[MaxonTreik]

Windfarms need to be by the sea to have any real effect

There are plenty of wind farms up here on farm land and moors and they work just fine.

Anyway, thorium is the way forward for nuclear energy.

 

[Reaper gI]

Windfarms need to be by the sea to have any real effect

There are plenty of wind farms up here on farm land and moors and they work just fine.

Anyway, thorium is the way forward for nuclear energy.

The problem is more windfarms need wind to have any real effect.
Same with solar and not working as well when it's overcast. (or at night)
Nuclear runs all the time, at the same rate.

No need to use thorium if you have uranium, the reactors still carry all the same problems (and need a bit of reaserch yet). Thorium is cheap, but nuclear power is cheap in comparison to alternatives anyway.

 

[Project-2501]

Windfarms in the UK are averaging less than 20% of design capacity. Hmmm.... And solar power is only surviving because they pay people 4x the normal electricity price per kWh.

Thorium still produces waste, can't be used on its own, isn't as good and still leaves you with the same decomissioning problem. Even fusion has drawbacks as the surrounding materials will become radioactive from high energy neutron bombardment.

 

[Ryo Chan]

Windfarms need to be by the sea to have any real effect

There are plenty of wind farms up here on farm land and moors and they work just fine.

didn't say they don't work on moors or farmlands, but to have anywhere near an effect as a nuclear plant u'd need hundreds of them, and considering how overpopulated our planet is already, you think replacing a town for a small windfarm is going to help much

Wind is more powerful near the sea, yes you can build farms inland and they'll generate power, but over a year 3 windmills inland will be lucky to generate the same as 1 at sea


End of the day, the way things are at the moment, renewable energy is only useful to generate a portion of the power a country needs, the rest of it relies on renewable energy, which costs more, and we're quickly running out of, or nuclear which is cheaper, lasts longer but has it's dangers

 

[MaxonTreik]

Windfarms in the UK are averaging less than 20% of design capacity. Hmmm.... And solar power is only surviving because they pay people 4x the normal electricity price per kWh.

Thorium still produces waste, can't be used on its own, isn't as good and still leaves you with the same decomissioning problem. Even fusion has drawbacks as the surrounding materials will become radioactive from high energy neutron bombardment.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thorium#Th ... clear_fuel

 

[Project-2501]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thorium#Thorium_as_a_nuclear_fuel

Might be worth reading the article more closely.

Key benefits
According to Australian science writer Tim Dean, "thorium promises what uranium never delivered: abundant, safe and clean energy - and a way to burn up old radioactive waste."[16] With a thorium nuclear reactor, Dean stresses a number of added benefits: there is no possibility of a meltdown, it generates power inexpensively, it does not produce weapons-grade by-products

The thorium fuel cycle creates 233U, which, if separated from the reactor's fuel, can be used for making nuclear weapons
...
Since there are no neutrons from spontaneous fission of U-233, solid U-233 can be used easily in a simple gun-type nuclear bomb design

Err... So it doesn't produce weapons grade byproducts but makes U233 which is good for making nuclear bombs.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thorium_fu ... clear_fuel

Though thorium-based fuels produce far less long-lived transuranics than uranium-based fuels,[7] some long-lived actinide products constitute a long term radiological impact, especially 231Pa.[8]

Pa231 has a half life of 32,000 years.

Basically its going back to the theories behind the breeder reactors which everyone was so dumb-**** scared of because they thought they were breeding weapons grade plutonium. And a thorium reactor is only meltdown proof if you use mixed fuel & coolant, but this coolant is molten salt at many hundreds of degC so if there is a leak you've got a mega problem of red hot molten salt and fissile material going everywhere. You wouldn't want to mix that with water

 

[Professor Irony]

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