Deaf langauge (English and BSL)

T

Taka88

Kiznaiver
Hello everyone,

I am create topic about Deaf. I really want everyone is understand why my english is not good. Lot people is here on forum is annoy about my english. I am deaf. My first langauge is BSL (Britian Sign Langauge ). My second langauge is English. I will teach you about what different between BSL and English. Deaf had two language, BSL is Britain Sign Language and SSE is Sign Supported English. SSE is mean sign to full english sencence and grammar. I chose BSL because my friend and school teacher use BSL.

BSL is used sign english. BSL not need say "ing" or "to" or "the" or "ed". That is why deaf people learn english is so hard. BSL is easy to understand and fast sign.

Example:

Hearing people will said: I going to shop today.
Deaf people will said : I go shop today.

Other example:

I go to college, i will sit and listain to teacher explain topic. Teacher will talk to full english sencence. My interpreter use BSL. My interpreter will explain to me to different way but will match to topic and will more quick. If my interpreter use to SSE, this mean it is very slow and will miss information.

Two reason is Deaf people write or read english is not good. One reason is Deaf can't hear to people talk. If i am hearing i will hear to people talk, my english will pefect. Two reason is Deaf people used to BSL because it is easy for them to understand.

I am happy if you want help to me improve english or transfer to english perfect. I am happy give answer to your question.

Thanks to read

Taka88
 
Very interesting! I'd heard of BSL but of course I didn't know how it fit into things and I'd never heard of SSE at all. It helps explain a lot of things :)

R
 
Very informative. It's easy to forget being native english speakers that it's one of the hardest languages to learn in the world, simply because so little of it makes sense grammatically at times :p
 
I see. I did always wonder how it's possible for there to be so many different combinations for the many words; so cutting out some connectives which are deemed unnecessary would make it easier (and I'd guess less tiring; I imagine ranting in sign language would be pretty exhausting?). Unfortunately, the only sign I know is the sign for Hitler xD

Still, your English is better than some I've seen from people with normal hearing...
 
I didn't know any of that Taka, and it's very helpful of you to inform us. Forgive me if I made a little fun of the way you wrote when you first joined. I tend to be rather cynical and distrustful at the best of times, and believe me when I say that there are people out there who'd invent things like this to make them seem above criticism and give them carte blanche to troll. But you seem to be sticking around and joining in discussion, so I do believe you to be genuine.

Part of me even thinks your way of doing things makes more sense.
Hearing people will said: I going to shop today.
Deaf people will said : I go shop today.
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We'd say "I am going to shop today", but really, those words are kind of superfluous anyway. People would know what you mean. I think it's most confusing for us when you use words like "is" in the wrong place, which makes it quite hard to read. But if you have to learn where to put those words after getting used to constructing sentences without them, I can see how that would be difficult.
 
Thanks for your post Takka! Very interesting.

Hearing people will said: I going to shop today.
Deaf people will said : I go shop today
Click to expand...

I think this is kind of like Japanese(no -ing or an equivalent) and it does seem a lot more logical then the English we speak to be honest.

I'm currently studying Japanese(first new language I've ever really studied), so I can imagine how challenging it is for you. Your doing very well though and we can all understand your posts.You'll have lots of oppurtunity to practice your written English on this forum now, which can only help, providing you don't let yourself get confused(as I often do) by the internet slang you might see around here occasionally.
 
vashdaman said:
I think this is kind of like Japanese(no -ing or an equivalent) and it does seem a lot more logical then the English we speak to be honest.
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Am I wrong in assuming the continuous tense verb conjugations are roughly equivalent to '-ing' then?

Y'know, たべる/たべいます　－＞　たべている/たべています?
 
@Vashdaman
What would a forum be without confusing internet slang, common culture references and memes?

@Taka88
Thanks for taking the time to explain the system; as Vashdaman say, it does kinda remind me of the little I know about Japanese in the sense of some words not being present in the sentence, and it seems a bit more contextual.

I haven't tried to learn Japanese though, so I could be completely off.

As long as we can understand the gist of what you're trying to say though, that's the main thing, and like the others mentioned, you'll probably get plenty of practice now you're here.
 
I am glad, i can help you to understand.

Let remind of you,I am not arrogant but honest to tell you. I am better write English than deaf peoples. Rare deaf people are write perfect English. If deaf people are join forum here, Member won't understand what is deaf people say. Deaf people not stupid. I been met lot of deaf peoples and they are clever people but their English is not good. I knew people will make joke or critical or dislike my style of English. I must admit i am bit upset but i am accept it because i understand people want to write perfect English. I not perfect person. Who want to perfect person ?

I always confused about past, present or future tense. Because they are similar word.

One thing, I not know what meaning of TROLL ?

Interpreter is work hard because their job is transfer sign English to BSL. I am went college and i am involved to HND (High National Dipolma) course. I am study to ICT business information technology. I am write asssignment is a mixed. (some part of BSL, some part of English). My interpreter will change BSL to English.

I not know Japanese is similar to BSL. Japanese is easy or hard language ? I heard Germany is easy learn to language.

Anyway, i will always make sure write English and make sure people will understand what i am saying.
 
Taka88 said:
One thing, I not know what meaning of TROLL ?
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Wikipedia defines it thus,

In Internet slang, a troll is someone who posts inflammatory, extraneous, or off-topic messages in an online community, such as an online discussion forum, chat room, or blog, with the primary intent of provoking readers into an emotional response or of otherwise disrupting normal on-topic discussion. The noun troll may refer to the provocative message itself, as in: "That was an excellent troll you posted".

While the word troll and its associated verb trolling are associated with Internet discourse, media attention in recent years has made such labels subjective, with trolling describing intentionally provocative actions outside of an online context. For example, mass media uses troll to describe "a person who defaces Internet tribute sites with the aim of causing grief to families."
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http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Troll_%28Internet%29
 
And just to elaborate, I didn't particularly see you engaging in that kind of behaviour Taka. I just suspected you might be creating a cover story to enable you to do so at a later date. I don't think you are any more, and this thread has gone a long way to help alleviate my doubts. My initial gut feeling is just generally to distrust people.
 
I do not find the way you type annoying. My younger brother has autism and he speaks a very similar way to you. It has taken me the better part 0f 25 years to understand him properly and there are times I still don't know what he is saying sometimes. Still is interesting to learn about BSL.

I have a question: have you learned to lip read or do you plan to learn to lip read?
 
I don't think that the style of BSL (as it has been described) is much like Japanese; if anything it's a lot more like Chinese with its completely different system for grammar. Japanese grammar is quite intricate in comparison, like ours.

I have Chinese relatives and those who weren't born over here struggle greatly with English every day, even though they can understand native speakers perfectly. The way they mentally construct their sentences is just completely different, it's almost like they have to translate what they want to say to English, then translate from that again to what we'd consider properly constructed spoken English. They'd not at all stupid, it's just they think about what they are saying in a different way. I understand that native English speakers often flounder quite a bit with Chinese languages as well.

Similarly, I have a relative, from another country, who has been learning English for many years now. She has a four year old child who has grown up here, and it is infuriating to her that already he has mastered some complex grammar patterns which don't come easy to her no matter how hard she studies. She's unquestionably more studious than the four year old scamp in that case, but there's a lot to be said for being completely immersed in the language to pick it up naturally.

I'm really enjoying reading Taka's explanations, and I don't find his posts hard to understand. It's good to have this topic here to demystify everything.

Some questions for Taka :)

Do you find it difficult to read posts by users who use more complicated grammar, or is it easy to read, just harder to write with? Or do people who post in a more direct way tend to be easier to understand as well?

R
 
Shirayuri said:
vashdaman said:
I think this is kind of like Japanese(no -ing or an equivalent) and it does seem a lot more logical then the English we speak to be honest.
Click to expand...

Am I wrong in assuming the continuous tense verb conjugations are roughly equivalent to '-ing' then?

Y'know, たべる/たべいます　－＞　たべている/たべています?
Click to expand...

Maybe, to be honest I find it best not to think about it too much, and then eventually things click. But here's a fact: I don't actually know what conjugated verb is, and I mean in English.

What would a forum be without confusing internet slang, common culture references and memes?
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A civilized place, lol. Well culture references are fine to an extent I guess, but I find the endless amounts of internet slang and memes to be rather irritating as people often use them like everyone automatically knows the meaning and spends as much time online as they do. Forums that heavily use such things only end up attracting a very limited and specific user base consequently.

Japanese is easy or hard language
Click to expand...

In my limited experience I think people make it sound way scarier then it is, it is obviously completely different from English in many ways, but I wouldn't let that put you off, it's a pretty logical language to be honest. I think learning mandarin (Chinese) would be harder.


As for the whole Troll thing, I think the term gets thrown around way to much and the definition seems to be very loose. For example I've never tried to bait an emotional response out of anyone here, but I've been accused of being a "toll" at least a few times now, I think people just fail to see my light hearted humour and get defensive. Although I can think of a few times I've helped take threads sort of off topic(which is apparently a sign of the troll), but not really as a game plan. Don't all good conversations start one place and end in another?

I think all this just makes forums inaccessible for the non-internet initiated.
 
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