So yeah this guy basically split the Fate universe away from the Tsukihime universe when he fought the moon (don't ask). It's pretty straight forward, if Zelretch loses to the moon (don't ask) Tsukihime happens, if Zelretch beats the moon (don't ask) then Fate happens. But right now we have two clear different universes, meanwhile Zelretch himself is the sorcerer of the second magic that directly links to the root.
Not knowing much about Tsukihime, this is really good to know. I always thought of Zelretch as a Shiki-level big deal in Nasuverse, but didn't realise that there was a branching point leading to these actually being two separate universes altogether as a result of his actions - fascinating stuff. His parallel universe second magic does fit very nicely with the multiple ones in Nasuverse, Deus ex machina levels of storytelling convenience heh. Which is why I'm surprised that I've so far only seen his involvement in the FGO universe in a very desirable craft essence or two heh.

Prisma Illya is one of the Fate series that I've never been very interested in picking up, but is it worth watching, in your opinions, if the story and lore in it are interesting?
 

Vincentdante

Railgun
Not knowing much about Tsukihime, this is really good to know. I always thought of Zelretch as a Shiki-level big deal in Nasuverse, but didn't realise that there was a branching point leading to these actually being two separate universes altogether as a result of his actions - fascinating stuff. His parallel universe second magic does fit very nicely with the multiple ones in Nasuverse, Deus ex machina levels of storytelling convenience heh. Which is why I'm surprised that I've so far only seen his involvement in the FGO universe in a very desirable craft essence or two heh.

Prisma Illya is one of the Fate series that I've never been very interested in picking up, but is it worth watching, in your opinions, if the story and lore in it are interesting?

It's an easy skip honestly. The whole thing starts a parody of the magical girl series right up until Season 3 when it actually get's a serious plot. The movie (which is a prequal) is worth checking out if you want to see Shirou become Archer for a bit.

Yeah Zelretch is a big name, and his gem sword was pretty over powered even by itself. Each blast Rin shot at Sakura from the sword had the same power level as a full on Excalibur shot. But the sword isn't a magical amplifier, or even a magical store house like Rin's jewels. It's real power is to create a microportal to a parallel world in the same space that the sword encompases. The blasts the sword shot out were actually just Rin draining the cavern of all of it's mana and shooting it out as a blast, opening a portal and then draining another universe's version of that cavern when she shot out another. Infinite Excalibur level blasts that doesn't even use the mages power.
 
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Takei Daloui

Straw Hat Pirate
Part of the reason Zelretch's power is so strong lies in the fact he uses magic, not magecraft. It's an important distinction. Magecraft can be boiled down to being a replication of what can be done in science. Magic is the impossible. Manipulation of matter, manipulation of parallel worlds, manipulation of time, manipulation of the soul, and one other. It's what cannot be done by anything else, and it actual changes with the time. Go back a few centuries, flying with mysteries would be considered magic because it was not possible outside of it, but when flight could be achieved normally it became a type of magecraft instead.
 

Vincentdante

Railgun
Lore musing post
Actually I was thinking of sharing my grand theory on who created the Lostbelts and why I think Salem holds the answer. The neat thing is I don't even need to talk any heavy spoilers (just Salem and the Lostbelts prologue) or Fate lore in general for this. Keep in mind I am unaware of any major plot revelations from the JP side so there is a good chance I maybe wrong. It's also likely there will be a lot more to the actual plot than what is in my theory.

Instead I'm going off topic to talk about another subject I'm pretty familiar with, which is Lovecraft lore (confession time I own all his stories in multiple formats, more than twice :p) and why I think Salem is the most important pseudo singularity for seeing the future. It's no secret that Nasu draws a lot of inspiration from Lovecraft, Just look at Heaven's Feel.

So err mild Salem spoilers here. We have quite a number of key players introduced. We have Randolph Carter who is basically the main character for many of Lovecrafts stories. Lavinia Wheatley who in lore mothered Wilbur Wheatley and the Dunwich Horror together. Abigail Williams who in real life set off the Salem witch hunts, and in lore is the avatar of Yog-sothoth. And both Randolph and Abby dissappear on a journey to other worlds at the end (very in character for Mr Carter) after Abby's power awakens when Lavinia dies.

Yog-sothoth for context is an outer god and the 2nd most powerful being in lovecraft lore, and Abby is the first Foreigner servant in the game. Then every single Foreigner after her also represents a different lovecraftian entity. E.g. Hokusai is an avatar for Cthulhu, Summer BB is an avatar for Nyarlathotep etc etc... (And my girl Abby is canonically stronger than all of those other GOO's, just sayin). But the point here is we now we have established a basis for lovecraft lore being introduced to Fate lore.

So where am I going with this you maybe asking? Well (prologue spoilers start here) the Lostbelts were created by an alien god after making a deal with Chaldeas Team A. An unknown alien god was introduced to the game right after the foreigner class was Introduced, a class that takes centre stage in stories they are involved in. I don't find that timing coincidental at all. We also discover that Chaldea is based in Antarctica before it got destroyed. Another well timed coincidence? Yeah I've read Mountains of Madness, a novel about aliens (the Elder Things) in Antarctica. This opens the door to other things, such as the Yithians whom the Elder Things went to war with, a species known to be able to mess with time and space in lore, and with Cthulhu's race too (Hokusai).

But I don't think it's Elder Things per say. More likely their enemies. The lost belts are created by an alien god afterall. Something that the foreigner class well represents and there are a number of outer gods in lovecraft lore that could easily fall into this category, even Yog-sothoth (abby) or possibly Azathoth?

So tldr is my theory could be one of a few things. It's either an outer god and we possibly haven't seen the end of Abby. Or perhapes it was the Yithians afterall and that silent alien girl is just a yithian from another plane just chilling and watching things go down?

Again this post is pure speculation and I bet there will be more to the overall plot itself than what I touched on. Plus even my own conclusion isn't fully set in stone as you saw. All I am doing is trying at an educated guess lol.
 
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Takei Daloui

Straw Hat Pirate
It's definitely interesting. It's worth keeping in mind though that alien god doesn't necessarily mean outer god. There have been other entities coming from space.
Greek gods are alien robots, beings like Quez are alien parasites
So it could be anything really.
 

Vincentdante

Railgun
It's definitely interesting. It's worth keeping in mind though that alien god doesn't necessarily mean outer god. There have been other entities coming from space.
Greek gods are alien robots, beings like Quez are alien parasites
So it could be anything really.
True, a part of me is wondering if it might even be an ultimate one from Nasu's own lore. You know one of the "Types"

Although alien robots is pretty lovecraft too hehe.
 
Lore musing post
Actually I was thinking of sharing my grand theory on who created the Lostbelts and why I think Salem holds the answer. The neat thing is I don't even need to talk any heavy spoilers (just Salem and the Lostbelts prologue) or Fate lore in general for this. Keep in mind I am unaware of any major plot revelations from the JP side so there is a good chance I maybe wrong. It's also likely there will be a lot more to the actual plot than what is in my theory.

Instead I'm going off topic to talk about another subject I'm pretty familiar with, which is Lovecraft lore (confession time I own all his stories in multiple formats, more than twice :p) and why I think Salem is the most important pseudo singularity for seeing the future. It's no secret that Nasu draws a lot of inspiration from Lovecraft, Just look at Heaven's Feel.

So err mild Salem spoilers here. We have quite a number of key players introduced. We have Randolph Carter who is basically the main character for many of Lovecrafts stories. Lavinia Wheatley who in lore mothered Wilbur Wheatley and the Dunwich Horror together. Abigail Williams who in real life set off the Salem witch hunts, and in lore is the avatar of Yog-sothoth. And both Randolph and Abby dissappear on a journey to other worlds at the end (very in character for Mr Carter) after Abby's power awakens when Lavinia dies.

Yog-sothoth for context is an outer god and the 2nd most powerful being in lovecraft lore, and Abby is the first Foreigner servant in the game. Then every single Foreigner after her also represents a different lovecraftian entity. E.g. Hokusai is an avatar for Cthulhu, Summer BB is an avatar for Nyarlathotep etc etc... (And my girl Abby is canonically stronger than all of those other GOO's, just sayin). But the point here is we now we have established a basis for lovecraft lore being introduced to Fate lore.

So where am I going with this you maybe asking? Well (prologue spoilers start here) the Lostbelts were created by an alien god after making a deal with Chaldeas Team A. An unknown alien god was introduced to the game right after the foreigner class was Introduced, a class that takes centre stage in stories they are involved in. I don't find that timing coincidental at all. We also discover that Chaldea is based in Antarctica before it got destroyed. Another well timed coincidence? Yeah I've read Mountains of Madness, a novel about aliens (the Elder Things) in Antarctica. This opens the door to other things, such as the Yithians whom the Elder Things went to war with, a species known to be able to mess with time and space in lore, and with Cthulhu's race too (Hokusai).

But I don't think it's Elder Things per say. More likely their enemies. The lost belts are created by an alien god afterall. Something that the foreigner class well represents and there are a number of outer gods in lovecraft lore that could easily fall into this category, even Yog-sothoth (abby) or possibly Azathoth?

So tldr is my theory could be one of a few things. It's either an outer god and we possibly haven't seen the end of Abby. Or perhapes it was the Yithians afterall and that silent alien girl is just a yithian from another plane just chilling and watching things go down?

Again this post is pure speculation and I bet there will be more to the overall plot itself than what I touched on. Plus even my own conclusion isn't fully set in stone as you saw. All I am doing is trying at an educated guess lol.
Thanks for the Lovecraft lore links with Nasuverse, very interesting to read as always. Tempted as I am, I have managed to resist reading the spoiler sections after. I had just started the second Lostbelt before Land of Shadows hit and I went into Lotto mode! But, I was certainly finding the Lostbelts following the Salem ending fascinating, even if my initial reaction was "huh, aliens?! Really Fate, really? Oh yeah, it's Fate, eeeeeverything goes!". I also see now how the Hokusai octopus fits nicely with the Cthulu reference heh. I'm probably not far enough in Lostbelts to see this link, but I was waiting for the story to bring back in the Caster of Limbo from Shimousa, who ended that pseudo-singularity with some very heavy foreshadowing.
 
Welcome to the Lostbelts. Oh man that Russian one was when I knew it would be getting real. Patxi made me sad.

Aliens aren't actually all that new to the lore as mentioned above :p
Yeah Lostbelts is pretty hard-hitting from the get go. You're a doggie person aren't you with Lobo and then Patxi? I did really like the first Lostbelt being mostly from Patxi's perspective, reminded me somewhat of how Monogatari moved it's perspective from the protagonist to the other cast with the second season.

You're right about aliens and all what with the Lovecraftian Salem, but I always viewed the latter as more fantasy than sci-fi so had to do an about turn heh. Still, leave it up Nasu for great story-telling spanning genres.
 

Vincentdante

Railgun
Hmm it's a little concerning that there hasn't been any more information on the western version for Mahoyo when we are a now only a few months away, which leads me to believe it might be digital only. In which case I shall keep my play-asia pre-order.

As an aside I dunno if this is a Japan thing but that limited edition for Mahoyo just came and went in a day, months ago and we still have no idea what is actually in it.
 

Vincentdante

Railgun
It's only an episode for now but apparently volume 8 of the LN is coming out so it is still progressing at least.

Shame the LN isn't offically available in english, I might check out a fan translation sometime though.

Tbh it's honestly the Light Novel and manga that get's me though, it seems like a lot of effort for a Fate/Prototype prequel. It's literally a single 12 minute long ova that acted as proof of concept for Fate/Stay Night so I have often wondered how Strange Fake managed to exist.

EDIT: Just rewatched Fate/Prototype. I forgot Gilgamesh actually used a bow for a bit.
 
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Takei Daloui

Straw Hat Pirate
Shame the LN isn't offically available in english, I might check out a fan translation sometime though.

Tbh it's honestly the Light Novel and manga that get's me though, it seems like a lot of effort for a Fate/Prototype prequel. It's literally a single 12 minute long ova that acted as proof of concept for Fate/Stay Night so I have often wondered how Strange Fake managed to exist.

EDIT: Just rewatched Fate/Prototype. I forgot Gilgamesh actually used a bow for a bit.
It's a shame so much of Fate isn't officially available in english really. They have some of the epics of remnant finally translated but as digital copies only, and so little else actual has a physical version in english. If there was I'd buy it in a heartbeat.
 
Oooh a new fate series, how interesting and more so for linking into Prototype. I was getting vibes that they were going to make a big deal of the Arthur character with the recent? relative publicity and availability of Prototype on YouTube, and then seeing his character presence in FGO (don't know if he appears in any events there specifically or in Lostbelts, though a different possibility of an integral character is right up there for Lostbelt fodder!), so am assuming any anime linking to Prototype is taking forward, or expanding on the story of the latter perhaps.

Hmm it's a little concerning that there hasn't been any more information on the western version for Mahoyo when we are a now only a few months away, which leads me to believe it might be digital only. In which case I shall keep my play-asia pre-order.

As an aside I dunno if this is a Japan thing but that limited edition for Mahoyo just came and went in a day, months ago and we still have no idea what is actually in it.
This reminded me about my preference to buy a specific Western release in order to support demonstrating the demand for Fate here i.e. give us more Fate stuff!! I see that my pre-order didn't actually hadn't go through on playasia so I guess I'll just switch tact and get the digital only version instead then.
 
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